Vegas Shooting

[Rocketsan 768]

Yeah exactly no one needs it, and while you may say gun deaths are dropping that is not saying much. The stats are staggering and the gun deaths are still at an absolutely ridiculous amount.

 

We don't have gun violence in Canada because it's so hard to obtain a firearm. Most of the deaths we have are from stabbings and you don't get these massacres. Knives were made as utensils and sometimes people use them for things they shouldn't, guns were made to kill people and that's what they do.

 

If people want to shoot targets then go take up archery, that's what people do here and it seems to be enough for them. Guns are for people in the military and police officers, a priveledge for them and something regular citizens have no business owning. Again one mans opinion, many share it and many don't.

Ya, not sure what part of Canada you live in, but we have gun violence...just not on the scale of down there...

[JTennant 290]

Fewer guns = Fewer gun crimes

 

However

 

Fewer guns does not equal lower violent crime rates. There are studies that show violent non gun related crimes are higher in cities and countries with extreme gun control measures.

[ndomer4 532]

Ya, not sure what part of Canada you live in, but we have gun violence...just not on the scale of down there...

 

Yah but it's not even close to the scale, we're talking different dimensions. Majority of the killings in Winnipeg are stabbings and we've been the murder capital for a very long time.

 

It's very rare.

[coltssb 1,044]

I'm neither her nor there when it comes to guns. But I have been on social media reading a lot of people defending the arms, saying if everyone was carrying that somebody could had taken this guy out earlier. Well, I wanted to comment, since you guys are pals;), but wasn't there a shyte load of cops WITH guns trying to take this guy down. And yet, they still didn't take him down. He took himself down. Just my own thought.

 

Sorry for loss Vegas.. prayers to you, the city, and everyone involved.

[coltssb 1,044]

Fewer guns = Fewer gun crimes

 

However

 

Fewer guns does not equal lower violent crime rates. There are studies that show violent non gun related crimes are higher in cities and countries with extreme gun control measures.

 

Yeah, you'll see videos of a knife wielding maniac from time to time on the news.

[JTennant 290]

[ame]

[/ame]

[ndomer4 532]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/03/americas/us-gun-statistics/index.html

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/10/02/las-vegas-shooting-united-states-world-when-comes-gun-homicides/724974001/

 

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/2/16399418/us-gun-violence-statistics-maps-charts

 

Ignoring these stats are delusional, time to wake up because you can't justify this.

[jessemoore97 1,280]

Broken families and communities exist outside of inner cities. Look at the per capita gun violence by state...doesn't exactly scream "urban" area, does it?

 

I really wanted touch on this and finally have the time to do so. Certainly problems exist outside inner cities no doubt. Using per capita rates is extremely misleading in this argument. I guarantee you the homicide rates are much higher in the urban areas of any state compared to everywhere else in the state. Put up a map plotting individual homicides in pretty much any state, and a large majority will be centered around the urban centers especially larger cities. Zoom in from the 10,000 foot view and in those cities you will see even smaller, concentrated clusters where gun homicides or homicides in general take place much more frequently.

 

It's absolutely a problem of epidemic proportions in these concentrated areas where broken families and or single motherhood, poor education opportunities, little job growth and employment, etc are prevalent. My gosh Iowa isn't exactly a populous state, but everyone can tell you which areas(cities) generate the most violent crime and down to the specific neighborhoods where it happens frequently. Iowa isn't an outlier either.

 

It's actually amazing some of the people who are finally realizing why it's happening. In the past few weeks alone I've had conversations with a few black men, who btw have seen their fair share of legal trouble. While engaging in an honest, intellectual conversations with these men, to the tee they all mentioned the biggest problem in the black community is the lack of fathers. They all related to me that they lacked strong male role models in their lives, and now after their trials and maturing came to this conclusion and have made the choice to try and be more influential in their children's lives. They concluded that how can a child succeed without proper guidance from both parents, stay away from drugs, to stress education, respect yourself and others, work hard and accomplish something rather than running the streets and partying all the time. I was extremely impressed and happy these guys came to these conclusions and are speaking up about it, maybe more people regardless of race will acknowledge problems like this.

[Synoptico 334]

Chicago, Baltimore, LA, DC, name your major American city which in any given year generates hundreds of homicides individually. Yet it's not a problem that broken families and communities is a major reason for the violence?

 

1. I didnt say it doesnt happen.

 

2. There are more people in cities

 

3. Why does cities =broken families?

[Synoptico 334]

Fewer guns = Fewer gun crimes

 

However

 

Fewer guns does not equal lower violent crime rates. There are studies that show violent non gun related crimes are higher in cities and countries with extreme gun control measures.

 

Yes but look at London bridge attack. How many more people would have died if he didnt only have a knife?

[jessemoore97 1,280]

1. I didnt say it doesnt happen.

 

2. There are more people in cities

 

3. Why does cities =broken families?

 

To clarify broken families a bit, singls motherhood. Unfortunately it is extremely high in the black community to the tune of about 70% or more. To be fair it has risen among whites as well to around mid 30's i believe i saw quoted. These numbers are astronomical compared to the early 70's when sociologists was raising alarms about those levels in both communities when they were around mid to low 20's and single digits respectively. What changed? A large measure is attributed to the welfare programs started LBJ in which the government basically stepped in and told women we'll give you stuff and take over the man's traditional role as the provider. But in order to get that you and your kids can't have the man around. Hence skyrocketing single motherhood rates and broken families, which then translates into worse conditions for children by and large that correlates into crime of all types etc etc. There have been many studies by econimists and social psychologists about this stuff. Again, why cities? Because as you said more people. Well in urban settings generally the poorest tend to be in the smaller clustered areas, especially in the minority community.

[Domer Dude 0]

Back to the subject.

 

White boy domestic terrorist killed 59+ people using fully automatic weapon.

 

Most ever in America. Cannot change the headline.

 

Time for lawsuits to fly. Bump Stock gone. Slide Fire gone. Gat Crank gone.

 

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/12-rifles-gunmans-hotel-room-had-bump-stocks-33-guns-purchased-past-year

 

Time to put the supporters of the legislation for these in the legal line of fire.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Domer Dude

[jessemoore97 1,280]

Back to the subject.

 

White boy domestic terrorist killed 59+ people using fully automatic weapon.

 

Most ever in America. Cannot change the headline.

 

Time for lawsuits to fly. Bump Stock gone. Slide Fire gone. Gat Crank gone.

 

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/12-rifles-gunmans-hotel-room-had-bump-stocks-33-guns-purchased-past-year

 

Time to put the supporters of the legislation for these in the legal line of fire.

 

I'd be in support of getting rid of the bump stock. Frankly I never heard of it or saw one until this happened.

[EddieAngel 508]

If the "war on terror" has taught us anything, it is that you cannot stop someone who is determined and willing to trade their life to take others.

 

Take guns out of the picture and this guy drives a truck filled with home made explosives through the gate of the venue and kills thousands.

 

I am not saying guns are not an issue, but they are not the issue here. Everyone wants to politicize and rationalize to try to fit an act like this into a little bite size piece we can digest, but if you have never dealt with extremists there is no way to explain it.

 

It's a bad world out there, especially outside North America. The ONLY thing we can do is try to raise our kids right and try to teach them the right kinds of values.

[Pregame 291]

If the "war on terror" has taught us anything, it is that you cannot stop someone who is determined and willing to trade their life to take others.

 

Take guns out of the picture and this guy drives a truck filled with home made explosives through the gate of the venue and kills thousands.

 

I am not saying guns are not an issue, but they are not the issue here. Everyone wants to politicize and rationalize to try to fit an act like this into a little bite size piece we can digest, but if you have never dealt with extremists there is no way to explain it.

 

It's a bad world out there, especially outside North America. The ONLY thing we can do is try to raise our kids right and try to teach them the right kinds of values.

I feel like this is a false equivalency. How often do homemade explosives get caught by the FBI for trying to buy bomb parts? How often do homemade explosives go off without a hitch?

 

And how often to people get caught legally purchasing firearms?

 

Also, what is the nonsense about the world outside of North America? This guy was a white American lol.

[Pregame 291]

I really wanted touch on this and finally have the time to do so. Certainly problems exist outside inner cities no doubt. Using per capita rates is extremely misleading in this argument. I guarantee you the homicide rates are much higher in the urban areas of any state compared to everywhere else in the state. Put up a map plotting individual homicides in pretty much any state, and a large majority will be centered around the urban centers especially larger cities. Zoom in from the 10,000 foot view and in those cities you will see even smaller, concentrated clusters where gun homicides or homicides in general take place much more frequently.

 

It's absolutely a problem of epidemic proportions in these concentrated areas where broken families and or single motherhood, poor education opportunities, little job growth and employment, etc are prevalent. My gosh Iowa isn't exactly a populous state, but everyone can tell you which areas(cities) generate the most violent crime and down to the specific neighborhoods where it happens frequently. Iowa isn't an outlier either.

 

It's actually amazing some of the people who are finally realizing why it's happening. In the past few weeks alone I've had conversations with a few black men, who btw have seen their fair share of legal trouble. While engaging in an honest, intellectual conversations with these men, to the tee they all mentioned the biggest problem in the black community is the lack of fathers. They all related to me that they lacked strong male role models in their lives, and now after their trials and maturing came to this conclusion and have made the choice to try and be more influential in their children's lives. They concluded that how can a child succeed without proper guidance from both parents, stay away from drugs, to stress education, respect yourself and others, work hard and accomplish something rather than running the streets and partying all the time. I was extremely impressed and happy these guys came to these conclusions and are speaking up about it, maybe more people regardless of race will acknowledge problems like this.

I think you have a misunderstanding of how "per capita" works...

[EddieAngel 508]

I feel like this is a false equivalency. How often do homemade explosives get caught by the FBI for trying to buy bomb parts? How often do homemade explosives go off without a hitch?

 

And how often to people get caught legally purchasing firearms?

 

Also, what is the nonsense about the world outside of North America? This guy was a white American lol.

 

It might be hyperbole, but it was just an off the cuff example. He could have improvised a pressure cooker filled with nails, he could have strapped himself with all manner of explosive and wandered to the gates and detonated. My point is only that if a person is determined, they will succeed. Maybe without the firearms he would have skipped that particular venue and just walked into a casino filled with people and done who knows what?

 

And there is no nonsense about White America, I am just saying that with all the violence that occurs here, it is far worse when you get outside of the protective shell that is the US.

 

My point is that the talk of gun violence is legitimate, but short sighted. Guns are a means to an end, but neither the beginning or the end in and of themselves.

[Pregame 291]

It might be hyperbole, but it was just an off the cuff example. He could have improvised a pressure cooker filled with nails, he could have strapped himself with all manner of explosive and wandered to the gates and detonated. My point is only that if a person is determined, they will succeed. Maybe without the firearms he would have skipped that particular venue and just walked into a casino filled with people and done who knows what?

Completely agree that the world has some bad people who intend to do harm to others and there's nothing you can do to completely eradicate. Just more meant that guns allow for more efficient violence if that makes sense.

[echo88 74]

Completely agree that the world has some bad people who intend to do harm to others and there's nothing you can do to completely eradicate. Just more meant that guns allow for more efficient violence if that makes sense.

 

I'd argue that social media is 10x the weapon of a firearm when it comes to compelling actual instances of violence...

[Pregame 291]

I'd argue that social media is 10x the weapon of a firearm when it comes to compelling actual instances of violence...

I'd probably agree with you, social media likely escalates violence. It's much easier to communicate quickly and threaten someone over a keyboard compared to facing them in person. I don't have a psychological/sociological study to back it up, just a hunch.