ND3 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Is this a declaration that this is all our own fault?? Yeah, that's what I gather from all the evidence that I'm aware of... I think what's happening right now is a consequence of Western actions but I'd be glad to hear a dissenting opinion. Like I said, my opinions are formulated from mostly biased sources that support my anti-interventionalist ideals. I do think that to find a solution we need to be well-educated on the foundations of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcubby 2 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 People like Ben Affleck can comfortably sit back and defend Islam because he knows that when they finally execute another large scale terrorist attack (and they will), he will be safe and secure up in the hills. Probably letting everyone knows what he thinks via Twitter. Wow...I argue this point all the time! Obama (and other elected idiots as well as the crazy rich) does NOT care one flying flip about what happens when these animals are brought into the country...because their kids will NEVER associate with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Wow...I argue this point all the time! Obama (and other elected idiots as well as the crazy rich) does NOT care one flying flip about what happens when these animals are brought into the country...because their kids will NEVER associate with them. Lol I just saw that there are states still willing to accept refugees. Take a look and see if you notice a pattern. Some people will never learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickman54 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Yeah, that's what I gather from all the evidence that I'm aware of... I think what's happening right now is a consequence of Western actions but I'd be glad to hear a dissenting opinion. Like I said, my opinions are formulated from mostly biased sources that support my anti-interventionalist ideals. I do think that to find a solution we need to be well-educated on the foundations of the problem. Ottoman Empire genocide of Armenians. 1915ish, you can argue the crusades but that's how many years before? They got everything they deserve, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ND3 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Ottoman Empire genocide of Armenians. 1915ish, you can argue the crusades but that's how many years before? They got everything they deserve, IMO. Sure, but after the Ottoman Empire was broken up, it was divided along oil field lines rather than cultural/racial boundaries. The recovery could have and should have been handled better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickman54 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Sure, but after the Ottoman Empire was broken up, it was divided along oil field lines rather than cultural/racial boundaries. The recovery could have and should have been handled better. Agreed, but that doesn't excuse the Neanderthal behavior from ME countries. it's going to be interesting and scary to watch this develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ND3 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Agreed, but that doesn't excuse the Neanderthal behavior from ME countries. it's going to be interesting and scary to watch this develop. Definitely something we can agree on. Hopefully it's handled with foresight instead of "what benefits us now" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickman54 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Definitely something we can agree on. Hopefully it's handled with foresight instead of "what benefits us now" I'm not sure that's possible in American politics anymore. Both sides are bought and paid for... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrown_9999 1,020 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 And so what if Israel fails to defend themselves? Our support of Israel is the primary reason that ISIS and other terror groups promote attacks on the West. What Im saying is that if we stop supporting them, ISIS might shift focus toward establishing their own state instead of waging jihad against those who spend resources preserving Israel. Israel is simply a proxy through which we can exert influence over the Middle East. The drone strikes alone certainly will not end ISIS. As for boots on the ground, I think our current policy is the correct one---insert JSOC elements to infiltrate and eliminate leadership one target at a time. It's the lightning to the drone's thunder. We dont need to send more conventional forces into those places. It would be no different than sending conventional forces into IQ and AF. They're just an occupying security force that does more harm than good. Why do the Moslems hate Israel so much? I just realized that I really do not know the answer to that question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Why do the Moslems hate Israel so much? I just realized that I really do not know the answer to that question. I suggest reading about Israel's reestablishment during the British Mandate for Palestine... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domer Dude 0 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Having 8 kids per women in desert countries with the import of modern medicine leads to lots of young men with nothing to do except bang the other half and make more babies and become disgruntled because there are no jobs. http://www.prb.org/Publications/Articles/2008/menafertilitydecline.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDhoosier 1,229 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Why do the Moslems hate Israel so much? I just realized that I really do not know the answer to that question. Its all kind of complicated and happened over long period of time, but the basic idea is that Israel is the Holy land that everyone in the region believes they have claim to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddieAngel 508 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Why do the Moslems hate Israel so much? I just realized that I really do not know the answer to that question. It is actually a two fold question: 1. Why do Muslims hate Jews (And everyone else for that matter) 2. Why the heck is everyone fighting over Israel (The place) To answer the second question first, the Jews believe that God gave them Israel as the promise land in the Bible. It is a pretty lengthy rundown, but suffice to say that the Jewish people truly have a long and documented history of suffering for Israel. They have been dragged off and burned out over and over and over again and they keep coming back. Real dedication. The Muslims took control of Jerusalem in 638 and made it a holy site. The Quran does not provide any support for Jerusalem specifically, but that is the Muslim interpretation. So both sides claim divine right. In answer to the second question, ALL religions are founded on the idea that they are the truth and believers are compelled to share their beliefs one way or the other. For Christians (Like myself) we are compelled by Jesus's words to go forth and make disciples and believers of all the nations. The Muslims interpret spreading their faith as killing all non-believers. That is not all Muslims, but rather the militant sect. Many millions of Muslims live in peace with people of other religions, it really isn't fair to generalize the entire group. Still, that is about the long and short of it. There is a a lot more to the entire situation than Muslims, Jews, etc... It is about global politics and economics. War is good business. It contributes to the global economy and reduces population surplus. It gives stronger powers the ability and excuse to take control of resources held by weaker powers. It would be nice to see all of the nations coming together against evil in an altruistic gesture, but that is just not the real world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 (edited) I actually blame religion as a whole. We are but a simple species who will look to any explanation, no matter how implausible or illogical, that pacifies our insecurities or fears. Religion is responsible for more murders than any other cause in history and I personally find it incredible that, considering the scientific leaps we've made in the past century, that it is even still fathomable to believe in a god. But that is just my opinion. The logical thing to do is to draw a parallel between ISIS' archaic interpretations of scripture and remember that Christianity, at one time, was interpreted similarly. We burned witches, permitted the church to have a say in almost all judicial hearings, persecuted heretics, and tortured non-believers while forcibly spreading the word to other cultures. Imagine for a second how much worse the Crusades would have been if media coverage and social media were involved. The only difference is that most of society, with the evolution of Christianity, has progressed with time and the societies of the Middle East, along with Islam, has lagged behind by a few centuries. They have been frozen in time and forgotten by the rest of the world.. Edited November 17, 2015 by echo88 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pregame 291 Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 The only difference is that most of society, with the evolution of Christianity, has progressed with time and the societies of the Middle East, along with Islam, has lagged behind by a few centuries. They have been frozen in time and forgotten by the rest of the world.. The weird thing about the advancement/lag gap is that it was inverse for the majority of the middle ages. The ME beat the west to most scientific advances and had a more progressive society for much of human history. Interesting that roles have reversed so drastically in the last few hundred years. I'm not ready to say there is an inverse relationship between religion and progress but there's a compelling argument in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim2Dokes 3 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 (edited) I actually blame religion as a whole. We are but a simple species who will look to any explanation, no matter how implausible or illogical, that pacifies our insecurities or fears. Religion is responsible for more murders than any other cause in history and I personally find it incredible that, considering the scientific leaps we've made in the past century, that it is even still fathomable to believe in a god. But that is just my opinion. The logical thing to do is to draw a parallel between ISIS' archaic interpretations of scripture and remember that Christianity, at one time, was interpreted similarly. We burned witches, permitted the church to have a say in almost all judicial hearings, persecuted heretics, and tortured non-believers while forcibly spreading the word to other cultures. Imagine for a second how much worse the Crusades would have been if media coverage and social media were involved. The only difference is that most of society, with the evolution of Christianity, has progressed with time and the societies of the Middle East, along with Islam, has lagged behind by a few centuries. They have been frozen in time and forgotten by the rest of the world.. No. Actually Iraq was fairly civilized before Russia and America came in and created what is now. http://www.businessinsider.com/amazing-pictures-of-peaceful-iraq-2014-6 ISIS is a gang. They may use religion as a means to gain power the same as American gangs use money ect. However, it is the same one a much larger level. Solve the problem? Probably would help not to kill civilians, million or so. Every person that has a family member killed is going to hate us. Add poverty and no hope in to the equation and they turn to ISIS and the like. Solve the problem? At this point realistically, Quinn from the show homeland laid it out. I get it is a TV show but pretty powerful statement when asked about how to deal with ISIS. Basically he asked the CIA to pay 100's of thousands to protect kids to go to school, they said no. His second option was turn it all into a parking lot. Obviously, education is always the best option. Saying Muslims to blame is simply ignorant and ethnocentric. Especially in the history of the Crusades ect. Lets not even get into colonization and all of that. Blaming someones religion could go into so many factors. Basically, you should be Buddhist if you want to feel clean. Almost all religions have been used to bring death and suffering to people. Finally, if you are Irish Catholic, as I am, you should be even more appalled by this thread. The English used religion to starve, kill, and take our land. It was really for power and resources. Are all British people to blame? Or we could just blame all conservatives for domestic terrorism. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/active-shooter-reported-in-colorado-springs-near-planned-parenthood_5658a87be4b079b2818a6d86?6kbdfgvi https://broadly.vice.com/en_us/article/abortion-clinics-are-burning-but-no-one-seems-to-care Edited November 28, 2015 by Jim2Dokes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Goblin 114 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Well, you can't convince me Islam is a religion of peace. The story of Muhammad and the Quran is about a pissed off guy (Muhammad) that gets tossed out of Mecca by non-believers and he raises an ARMY and commits raids and fights battles against the non-believers before finally conquering the city that "wronged" him. It's indefensible as a religion of peace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 No. Actually Iraq was fairly civilized before Russia and America came in and created what is now. http://www.businessinsider.com/amazing-pictures-of-peaceful-iraq-2014-6 Cool pictures. In the 60's, they also still imposed Sharia Law. It's nice that you can reference people sipping tea and swimming in pools when claiming a society hasn't been hampered by its religion. I wonder why those pics don't show anyone being stoned to death or having their limbs hacked off. Americans and Russians didn't teach them that. Their prophet did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 "Couple's motives remain a mystery"??? LOLOL. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/couples-motive-in-california-rampage-a-mystery-for-police-family/ar-AAfYExB?li=BBnb7Kz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donjuan 16 Posted December 3, 2015 Author Share Posted December 3, 2015 "Couple's motives remain a mystery"??? LOLOL. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/breakingnews/couples-motive-in-california-rampage-a-mystery-for-police-family/ar-AAfYExB?li=BBnb7Kz Well surprise, surprise. Just heard CNN call it "hybrid workplace violence," whatever the hell that is. Muslims sure are peaceful. "The acts of a few," really? Every damn day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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