Cops and Robbers

[Rocketsan 773]

because you give constructive criticism? Pessimism for Notre Dame football is not constructive criticism bro. But thanks for trying to derail a thread in order to get your jab in...

 

LOL, you are a sensitive bear...

:panda:

[Rocketsan 773]

My first experience with being pulled over happened when I was young. My dad was driving in souther mich or northern in. He got pulled over for speeding. The cop asked him where he was going in such a hurry. My dad apologized for speeding and said we were on our way to our first ND football game. The officer looked in the back seat fill with me and my brothers all decked out in ND gear. The officer said watch your speed and have fun at the game. Nice officer or Our Lady of Victory watching out for us? Maybe both.

As for me being pulled over, I am always polite and have my licsence and registration ready. Works for me.

 

Similar. Roomate gets pulled over doing 50+ over the speed limit. We get nailed. He gets a huuuge ticket (almost a $1000) and two demerit points. Roomie goes to court to ask to be able to pay it in instalments. Judge asks why he was speeding.

 

Roomie says "we spent weekend at Notre Dame for a football game and I was hurrying to get home to study for exams."

 

Judge says "Nice! I graduated from Notre Dame law...$90 have a good day..."

[coltssb 1,044]

I used to see this on Cops a lot. The guy is fleeing, he crashes his vehicle. He gets out, but realizes he is corned, he lays on his stomach, BUT then you see some cops come in for a few rough ups. I guess my question would be, are cops pissed because they had to chase the guy? Is it a way to get in a few elbow rubs to the head fot the guying being a d@#$? Or is it simply for your guy's protection?

 

Interesting that I see this in my own question.........There was a wild police chase yesterday in South Bend that led to a man getting shot 7 times by police. From the many articles I have read, it says that the gentleman rammed a police car head on and the police felt threatened to shoot. Reports say many officers opened fired but not claiming how many. The gentleman in the car did not have a gun, what constitutes police to open fire on the person in a wild police chase? Don't they shoot out the tires first or try other preventative measures?

[SpeedsterX 652]

Interesting that I see this in my own question.........There was a wild police chase yesterday in South Bend that led to a man getting shot 7 times by police. From the many articles I have read, it says that the gentleman rammed a police car head on and the police felt threatened to shoot. Reports say many officers opened fired but not claiming how many. The gentleman in the car did not have a gun, what constitutes police to open fire on the person in a wild police chase? Don't they shoot out the tires first or try other preventative measures?

 

LOL! You've been watching to many TJ Hooker Shows. No, Police do not shoot at tires. A vehicle IS a deadly weapon and when a "gentleman" uses a car as a deadly weapon against Police, Police respond with deadly force. You will notice that the Police did not shoot FIRST and then the CRIMINAL rammed the Police. Police shoot to stop deadly aggression,,,,, PERIOD! Not to slow him down! Not to maim! No trick shots or warning shots. To STOP the threat! We are never trained to shoot at hands, legs or items held by the CRIMINAL. We are trained to shoot CENTER MASS.

 

As for your earlier question about a criminal getting a few "rough ups" for running from the Police. It is my understanding that it USED to be that way. I've heard that back in the day, if you ran, you got an ass beating. Well, in this day and age of cellphone camera's and such it's not like that anymore. I won't say it will never happen again, but it's not how we do things. Now in your scenario, where one runs and then just stops and gives up peacefully. That very rarely happens! If they run, they are running for a reason and if we catch up with the criminal, chances are more likely that they will CONTINUE to resist (like Tommy did) and that is where physical force (hands on, taser etc.) is used.

Edited May 13, 2012 by SpeedsterX

[dylanbg20 0]

LOL! You've been watching to many TJ Hooker Shows. No, Police do not shoot at tires. A vehicle IS a deadly weapon and when a "gentleman" uses a car as a deadly weapon against Police, Police respond with deadly force. You will notice that the Police did not shoot FIRST and then the CRIMINAL rammed the Police. Police shoot to stop deadly aggression,,,,, PERIOD! Not to slow him down! Not to maim! No trick shots or warning shots. To STOP the threat! We are never trained to shoot at hands, legs or items held by the CRIMINAL. We are trained to shoot CENTER MASS.

 

As for your earlier question about a criminal getting a few "rough ups" for running from the Police. It is my understanding that it USED to be that way. I've heard that back in the day, if you ran, you got an ass beating. Well, in this day and age of cellphone camera's and such it's not like that anymore. I won't say it will never happen again, but it's not how we do things. Now in your scenario, where one runs and then just stops and gives up peacefully. That very rarely happens! If they run, they are running for a reason and if we catch up with the criminal, chances are more likely that they will CONTINUE to resist (like Tommy did) and that is where physical force (hands on, taser etc.) is used.

 

+1..........

[NDhoosier 1,232]

Interesting that I see this in my own question.........There was a wild police chase yesterday in South Bend that led to a man getting shot 7 times by police. From the many articles I have read, it says that the gentleman rammed a police car head on and the police felt threatened to shoot. Reports say many officers opened fired but not claiming how many. The gentleman in the car did not have a gun, what constitutes police to open fire on the person in a wild police chase? Don't they shoot out the tires first or try other preventative measures?

 

Well for your original question about cops jumping on guys who are on their stomachs after a chase... It is for protection. I have seen suspects obey with our orders, but when we get close, they attack us. We dont take chances, if you run from the police, we believe you are capable of anything. We tackle you and pin you down so you dont have a chance to second guess yourself and continue the fight.

 

Speedster answered the other question adequately. A car is considered a deadly weapon, if you try to run us over, you get shot. There are very few instances where we shoot the tires, but if someone is trying to run us over, we shoot back...

 

I know a lot of the TV series these days are based on law enforcement, but realize one thing... Half of the shit that happens in those shows are BS... How quickly CSI gets their information and police tactics go out the window in movies and TV shows. Officers are not trained to shoot anywhere by center mass. Cops in the movies shoot the arms and hands like it was their job, that is not only VERY difficult, shit like that will get you killed.

 

Preventative measures that you speak of in a typical chase (5 squad cars following the suspect) mainly consists of stopping sticks to pop your tires, but when your car stops, you are still a threat. If we are in a parking lot and I am issuing you commands and you floor the car and try to hit me or run me over, that is when bad things happen.

[coltssb 1,044]

LOL! You've been watching to many TJ Hooker Shows. No, Police do not shoot at tires. A vehicle IS a deadly weapon and when a "gentleman" uses a car as a deadly weapon against Police, Police respond with deadly force. You will notice that the Police did not shoot FIRST and then the CRIMINAL rammed the Police. Police shoot to stop deadly aggression,,,,, PERIOD! Not to slow him down! Not to maim! No trick shots or warning shots. To STOP the threat! We are never trained to shoot at hands, legs or items held by the CRIMINAL. We are trained to shoot CENTER MASS.

 

You are somewhat correct, I was relying on a show, Cops! On some chases the guy rams a cop car and then crashes, he tries to get out and run and they chase the guy down. I have NEVER seen the cops open fire Bonnie and Clyde style on a car when it is already crashed for a guy with a DWI. Now, I understand Cops is only a show, and different scenio's call for different situations, but shooting an unarmed man 7 seven times, while the car was crashed seems a bit excessive. They shot this guy in his "both hands"(was he giving up), shoulder, arm, chest, and stomach. From news outlets and from people who saw it go down, say the police just opened fired. The reason I know about this story and I am following it...... That "gentlman" is a family member! I'll try to wait on judgement, I'll wait to hear my family member's side of the story(not just the cops), but if from what I am hearing from witnesses is true...Then I have lost all respect for the South Bend Police Department, Sorry.......I'll end my concerns here.....

[SpeedsterX 652]

Well, my last word is this. Your family member RAN from the Police. He WAS armed with a 2000 pound missile/weapon we call a car. If he tried to ram the Police with it, he met lethal force.

 

No disrespect to you but I am sick of friends and family members of criminals always blaming the Police for their criminal family members actions and claim "witnesses" saw it differently. We'll see how this shakes out and IF (A HUGE IF) the Police were wrong. I will be the first to admit they were wrong but from what I'VE seen and heard, it's going to be pretty clear cut.

Edited May 13, 2012 by SpeedsterX

[artfernisanass 0]

Interesting that I see this in my own question.........There was a wild police chase yesterday in South Bend that led to a man getting shot 7 times by police. From the many articles I have read, it says that the gentleman rammed a police car head on and the police felt threatened to shoot. Reports say many officers opened fired but not claiming how many. The gentleman in the car did not have a gun, what constitutes police to open fire on the person in a wild police chase? Don't they shoot out the tires first or try other preventative measures?

 

deadly force is used when an officer reasonably fears that his/her own life is in imminent danger or the life of someone else is in imminent danger. In other words, it's justified when the officer believes deadly force must be used to prevent death or great bodily harm to him/herself or others.

 

as far as funny stories...i always get a kick out of when a suspect on his way to county asks me, from the back of my squad car, "will this hurt my chances of becoming a police officer?"

 

i've also forgotten to turn off my overhead lights a time or two after a stop and get quite the looks while i'm stopped at stop lights with the overhead's going - funny but embarrassing!

[SpeedsterX 652]

 

i've also forgotten to turn off my overhead lights a time or two after a stop and get quite the looks while i'm stopped at stop lights with the overhead's going - funny but embarrassing!

 

Yea, or you're driving slowly down the road and people in front start pulling over and you're thinking, "Why the hell are people stopping?" Then you realize you forgot to turn them off! lol #embarrassing!

[coltssb 1,044]

Well, my last word is this. Your family member RAN from the Police. He WAS armed with a 2000 pound missile/weapon we call a car. If he tried to ram the Police with it, he met lethal force.

 

No disrespect to you but I am sick of friends and family members of criminals always blaming the Police for their criminal family members actions and claim "witnesses" saw it differently. We'll see how this shakes out and IF (A HUGE IF) the Police were wrong. I will be the first to admit they were wrong but from what I'VE seen and heard, it's going to be pretty clear cut.

 

I appreciate you cleaning up that quote. It didn't make you sound that good...I hope it doesn't represent your true character... Anyways, I do not disagree with you. You do the crime you do the time. Whatever the judge hands out I will be 100 percent behind. But I will say that the facts so far in this case have more holes than the Chicago Cubs infield(terrible "On the Waterfront" line). That's why I said I will hold judgement on the SB police and on my family memeber. I don't agree with anything he has done, but I do not agree with firing squads either. And I guess that's my point, no "Rodney King" type scenerio's after the person is caught or is injured after the event. This is not "Dirty Harry." It's not by all means necessary. If he has a gun or weapon than I understand. I understand the point of the car being used as a weapon too. But that is one fact in this case that I am finding some fault with. I will not clarify more because it is being discussed along with other events....Now saying that, I STILL support the police, I am thankful for their hard work and effort in stopping crime. Just like the military folk. And, I will CONTINUE to support the guys in blue, but if by chance, stories are being made up to cover one's behind. Then I have a problem.

[J.P. 0]

Not trying to jump in the middle of anything but officers dont know what suspects have in thier vehicles until its all overwith all we know is they they have shown that in this type of situation the person has and will do whatever they possiably can to get away.

[coltssb 1,044]

Not trying to jump in the middle of anything but officers dont know what suspects have in thier vehicles until its all overwith all we know is they they have shown that in this type of situation the person has and will do whatever they possiably can to get away.

 

I completely agree! But isn't their protocol first? HANDS UP!? Maybe that's what happened. Again, I have a lot more questions but I am seriously just waiting for all the facts to come out first before posting or making a judgement.

[J.P. 0]

I completely agree! But isn't their protocol first? HANDS UP!? Maybe that's what happened. Again, I have a lot more questions but I am seriously just waiting for all the facts to come out first before posting or making a judgement.

 

Yeah I would like to know what all comes of this.

[SpeedsterX 652]

I appreciate you cleaning up that quote. It didn't make you sound that good...I hope it doesn't represent your true character... Anyways, I do not disagree with you. You do the crime you do the time. Whatever the judge hands out I will be 100 percent behind. But I will say that the facts so far in this case have more holes than the Chicago Cubs infield(terrible "On the Waterfront" line). That's why I said I will hold judgement on the SB police and on my family memeber. I don't agree with anything he has done, but I do not agree with firing squads either. And I guess that's my point, no "Rodney King" type scenerio's after the person is caught or is injured after the event. This is not "Dirty Harry." It's not by all means necessary. If he has a gun or weapon than I understand. I understand the point of the car being used as a weapon too. But that is one fact in this case that I am finding some fault with. I will not clarify more because it is being discussed along with other events....Now saying that, I STILL support the police, I am thankful for their hard work and effort in stopping crime. Just like the military folk. And, I will CONTINUE to support the guys in blue, but if by chance, stories are being made up to cover one's behind. Then I have a problem.

 

Yea, I cleaned it up just a bit as I am more sensitive to the situation than it appeared at first. I will say this after talking to some people that I can say here.

 

He ran, he had a reason to run and I know what that reason was so it wasn't like he didn't try and get away for a good reason or he was a Boy Scout.

 

In the process of running by vehicle (mistake #1), he rammed a Police car head on (mistake #2, lethal #1). THAT Officer got out and placed him at gunpoint and DID order him out of the car. This is where he made his 3rd and most important mistake. He shifted into reverse and rammed the Police vehicle behind him while the Officer was exiting the vehicle to get away. That's when lethal force was used. At no point was he trying to "give up" and he was using that car in any way to get away, he didn't care what he was ramming into or who got in the way.

 

We get in many pursuits every year and it is extremely rare that it ends up in shooting but NOT rare that we catch them. With all that said,,

 

I am sorry for your family. I really am.

 

Update: Per WNDU, "We have new information about the man who police shot after he hit two squad cars during a pursuit Saturday afternoon in South Bend. It turns out it wasn't his first run-in with the law. Hear from the suspect's brother at 11."

Edited May 14, 2012 by SpeedsterX

[The Four Horsemen 6]

One thing most people don't ever think about is that officers have lives too, we want to go home at the end of our shift just like everybody else. We have wives, children and friends that we look forward to seeing when we get home.

 

In situations like this, officers are forced to make a split second decision and you cannot hesitate. When a person is using any type of deadly force, whether it is a car, gun, knife, baseball bat or any other form of weapon that could cause me to not go home at the end of the day, I am going to stop him before he stops me, period!

 

Police officers go through countless hours of training to help make these decisions. Most days we don't/didn't have to make these judgement calls but when the time arrives, there can be no hesitation. I can tell you without any doubt in my mind that a police officer does not start his shift with the intent on taking a life. Firing your weapon at a suspect is the absolute last thing that an officer wants to do. An officer has many options to stop force against them but when a suspect uses deadly force, they will be responded to with that same deadly force, period.

[Soko 128]

I met a man in Vietnam a couple of years ago whose son was killed by a police officer who fired from behind a car at his wife who had faked filled out some fake prescriptions in a drug store. The shots were fired after she had driven past the said officer, admittedly in a unsafe manner but where was the need to fire then? That officer was the first ever to be tried for murder in Arizona but he escaped conviction but the state paid out millions in liability.

 

 

 

While searching for a link online to that event I found this. Blasting a grandfather in the head with his grandson in his hands?

 

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/february172012/grandad-baby-shot-tk.php

[GunSlinger 28]

Yea, or you're driving slowly down the road and people in front start pulling over and you're thinking, "Why the hell are people stopping?" Then you realize you forgot to turn them off! lol #embarrassing!

 

LMAO, Ive done that before! I came to a red light at busy intersection and the north and south bound traffic have a green light. Im sitting there and nobody is moving and are just looking at me at which time I finally realize. I have also jumped out of my car without putting it into park once. Thankfully I was able to jump back in before really rolled some where.

[NDhoosier 1,232]

I met a man in Vietnam a couple of years ago whose son was killed by a police officer who fired from behind a car at his wife who had faked filled out some fake prescriptions in a drug store. The shots were fired after she had driven past the said officer, admittedly in a unsafe manner but where was the need to fire then? That officer was the first ever to be tried for murder in Arizona but he escaped conviction but the state paid out millions in liability.

 

 

 

While searching for a link online to that event I found this. Blasting a grandfather in the head with his grandson in his hands?

 

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/february172012/grandad-baby-shot-tk.php

 

lol, that is the most anti-police article I have seen in quite awhile. They dont even try to hide their biases. It even says that the information is limited, yet they continue to bash the officer and his past. I dont judge without the information, but these guys are terrible...

[GunSlinger 28]

lol, that is the most anti-police article I have seen in quite awhile. They dont even try to hide their biases. It even says that the information is limited, yet they continue to bash the officer and his past. I dont judge without the information, but these guys are terrible...

 

http://www.azcentral.com/community/scottsdale/articles/2012/02/15/20120215shooting-seventh-scottsdale-police-officer.html

 

I agree, Id have a real problem letting this guy who previously pointed a waepon at a neighbor barricade himself in a home with an infant. Nice grandfather using his grandson as a human shield.