Wharton70

3 different ND groupings (some overlap) HH had a major hand in developing and/or recruiting all three - and this with Mike McG and Nick Martin lurking 'behind' these fellows - who deserve congratulations. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ENYZYZAWwAEXI9B.jpg

To me, if a QB isn’t accurate, he’s not worth a damn. Agreed - Bill Walsh said that (far and away) the most important thing in judging / picking a QB was accuracy... think Montana and Young - from memory, neither was a blazer, but their scalpel like accuracy won. Good point on the Cincy QBs as well.

The direct conclusion that most will jump too is Hiestand to OL and Quinn to TE's BUT I'm not sure Kelly wants to go back to the future. I only can hope that he does. He talks about firing a guy in his wedding, so a ding to Quinn (=> TEs) would put CBK's $ where his mouth is. Quinn may be adequate and comfortable, but he isn't much more than 60% of Harry (who, BTW, turned out to be a HELL of a recruiter). No tears for Jeff, CBK took good care of him since he flamed out in Buffalo, and the talent (much of which HH recruited) counterbalanced the adequate coaching and kept the OL from having a disappointing year. Just MHO. Brian, Happy New Year and all the best in 2020 to you and all on this great board.

Brian, you are a paragon of knowledge, dedication, and decency. We are all better for knowing you. God Bless you and yours.

Disagree. I am a 1968 grad, and yes, many geezers do what has been mentioned. HOWEVER they also have suffered through the eras of Davie, Willinghan, Brennan, Kuharich etc, and many (self included) are too stiff of body due to old age and 'meritorious' injuries, to enjoy the cement seat cals that we did decades ago, so cut us a break and skip the condescending generalizations. As to stuck up - in the pre 80s perhaps even the pre 90s, the school and the student body was predominantly 'blue collar' and damn glad / proud to be on campus, at a game etc. From what I have seen on campus and heard, the attitude (not the fact) is what Ted envisioned - the "ivy of the mid-west". But also having an Ivy degree, I'd say that it falls short, and that ND has become just another diploma factory with candle light vigils to comfort the 'distraught students' because Trump won - i.e. Snowflake U. What made it unique is gone. A 'stuck up' old bast**d

Great analysis as usual, Faith - I agree with all the points, and would add Longo (hope he is well) to Denbrock & VanGorder.

Originally Posted by Rocketsan View Post You call the coach of the year a loser. You slag players stepping in to fill in for the injured who may not be ready to perform on the biggest of stages. You immediately demand the school lower its expectations to meet yours. You call for the hire of men who would do just about anything to win - even when it is wrong. You discount or dismiss every one of the 12...12! win this team had. When players and coaches are beating the likes of Michigan week one - they are legends; when they struggle against Ball State they are garbage. The emotional liability of the team’s fanbase is a joke. Flame on. I’ve said my piece. See you in September. As usual, I agree with Jersey and Rocket. After a 'wailing & gnashing' e-mail from a 3rd fellow graduate, I sent this to them: "News flash. Neither Ara, nor Lou are coaching at ND. The exceptional tactical and strategic abilities, and the recruiting skills that brought victories against The Bear, the Cheerios bowl, Miami, and FSU have left the building. Still many times better than Gerry, tyrone, and puddin' pants, so be grateful and quit whining. Happy Freaking New Year." I have followed the team since the early 50's and got my degree in 1968. My 4 years were Ara's 1st 4. The lesson in perspective that I have learned through the ups and downs is that gratitude makes both better - the success sweeter, and the defeats more tolerable. I am grateful for the success of this team, that CBK has gotten out of the way and let some very fine assistants work, and that the athletes seem to be exceptional young men. End of sermon.

Great topic & posts. A class mate (Pete Farrell) suggested that I went to the school that they tore down to build 'The Old School... reading this I agree - in the past several decades, I have bought one item. a classic ND seal t-shirt - in 2010. I do not wear it on game day. Ditto my great 2 Subway Domer shirts - F*CK U$C and Muck Fichigan - bad karma - always tanked when worn on game day. Two best are the Lyons Hall - Maura Fox run shirts and the Sox 2004 "It's Time To Cowboy Up, Boston" shirts. They seem to do the trick. Again, great post.

I agree 100% - I have liked the way he plays for his whole career, and for those who didn't think he mirrored Wes Welker (in his prime), re watch last night - game balls to him & Gilmore - both 'studs'.

and my freshman year - 1964. Still have nightmares.

Especially late in the season. Reduce player wear and tear, and use the weather to ND's advantage by getting some of the pacific and southern teams to visit in November.... Surf's Up, Dude.

Dead on as usual. Could the spacing issue also com in to play by enabling more short / medium crossing routes? I seem to remember that Cinci had good success with that (to the slot?), and while ND has a victim of this on defense, I don't remember it being used effectively in the CBK era.

Davis - agree 100% - he is cut from the Welker mold, if only coach numbn*ts could listen (first time for everything) to how his buddy Bill from Boston rode the Wes/Julian/Danny road to success.... if only.

Amazing to see some of these names - civilians like me have no idea what in regard the professionals hold some of the McElwains of the coaching fraternity. Thanks.

Trying to attach

Agree 100% - & unless he gets it, it would be logical to expect him to join Elko - who I am pretty sure would find a place for him. The job that he did with Coney and all the LBs merits the move.

Probably best if before 1/15 - when players have to declare - Tillery and Coney - both key elements - may be tipped in that direction by uncertainty... Hope not.

Great stuff, Cory - thanks - gives hope that there is a viable answer out there. On the downside, could there be breakage (Lea / Elston) if ND goes outside. May have to.

Eddie - Absolutely Priceless - top 10 quote of the year.

"There's no excuse for coming in and looking unprepared." Agree 100% - but in the Wake, Navy, and Miami games, and I think Stanford as well, they came out flat. Got away with it in the 1st 2, paid for it in the other 2. As they took the field against Miami especially, the 'Canes had adrenaline spurting out of their ears, and ND looked like a Tuesday morning commuter getting on the bus enroute to a dull office job. Hopefully Christmas with the folks will help fix that. Which leaves the question of game coaching & strategy. The difference? Contrast the above with Lou against F$U & Miami.

This would all be true if it was Joe Smith, a non Catholic from, say, west of the Mississippi, or a Dan Mullen, but this is an Irish Catholic from Boston... it is a DNA thing. I doubt that he would consider any other (perhaps U$C) college job a step up (that his considerable ego would allow him to take), unless the lynch mob was on his heels (e.g. if he had gone 4 & 8 this year). I think that an East Coast Pro job (Philly, NYG, or especially the Pats) would draw him. That said, even though there is one born every minute... No, he is here for another 3 - 4 years, then the toll will tell, as with Ara, and as they say, He Gone. Until then he is here.

When the Miami DC & staff knew (and were laughing their asses off in the coaches box) what was going to be run before the snap, not only poor, but transparent. Do you think Kelly took a more active role in the play calling later in the season, or did the 1st 6 or so games give Long's blueprint. I'd lean toward the former.