coltssb 1,044 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Agreed, and I am not saying this officer is 100% innocent, but the number of shots is being blown out of proportion. Really? He went down on the first shot. I was waiting for the movies here. Unload the first clip only to reload the second clip and unload that one too. 16 shots is excessive. Imagine a self defense case where the person dead was shot 16 times. I bet the jury is going to find it hard to believe the person was still in self defense after the tenth shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stdntDrvr 12 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Really? He went down on the first shot. I was waiting for the movies here. Unload the first clip only to reload the second clip and unload that one too. 16 shots is excessive. Imagine a self defense case where the person dead was shot 16 times. I bet the jury is going to find it hard to believe the person was still in self defense after the tenth shot. My handgun holds 19 (1 in the chamber, 18 round magazine), so he may have not needed to reload. ..and as stated above, it doesn't take much time at all to fire 16 rounds. I'm not saying it's justified, because I don't know...I wasn't there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 If that was my son I don't think I'd consider the shooting justified. If it was your son, you'd probably be wondering why he was a convicted thug walking around on PCP while brandishing a knife..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 Really? He went down on the first shot. I was waiting for the movies here. Unload the first clip only to reload the second clip and unload that one too. 16 shots is excessive. Imagine a self defense case where the person dead was shot 16 times. I bet the jury is going to find it hard to believe the person was still in self defense after the tenth shot. Once you put someone else's life at risk with threatening behavior, you lose the right to criticize how many shots a person with adrenaline running through their veins during fight or flight mode fires to neutralize you. I'd empty the clip without batting an eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltssb 1,044 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 My handgun holds 19 (1 in the chamber, 18 round magazine), so he may have not needed to reload. ..and as stated above, it doesn't take much time at all to fire 16 rounds. I'm not saying it's justified, because I don't know...I wasn't there. I'm getting off topic here...But are you saying that cops aren't getting enough speciality training that they can't distinguish between firing 6 shots or 16? That regular police stops are becoming the O. K. Corral? That our police forces when faced with any adroitness, are crapping their pants? I guess that's my complaint. Are we asking too much of our police now? The firing of shots may or may not matter in some cases. But the alarming rate of police shootings seem to be on an astronomical rise. Maybe it's all the media at our disposal. I'm not sure. But it does seem to be getting out of hand. Maybe new laws should be enacted? When pulled over, you must shut off your car and you must put your hands out the window. I don't know. Somethings a miss here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 I'm getting off topic here...But are you saying that cops aren't getting enough speciality training that they can't distinguish between firing 6 shots or 16? That regular police stops are becoming the O. K. Corral? That our police forces when faced with any adroitness, are crapping their pants? I guess that's my complaint. Are we asking too much of our police now? The firing of shots may or may not matter in some cases. But the alarming rate of police shootings seem to be on an astronomical rise. Maybe it's all the media at our disposal. I'm not sure. But it does seem to be getting out of hand. Maybe new laws should be enacted? When pulled over, you must shut off your car and you must put your hands out the window. I don't know. Somethings a miss here. I'd crap my pants too if, in addition to having to worry about being killed in the line of duty, I had to worry about losing my job when my career was threatened by the PC backlash plaguing this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 74 Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 (edited) I'm getting off topic here...But are you saying that cops aren't getting enough speciality training that they can't distinguish between firing 6 shots or 16? That regular police stops are becoming the O. K. Corral? That our police forces when faced with any adroitness, are crapping their pants? I guess that's my complaint. Are we asking too much of our police now? The firing of shots may or may not matter in some cases. But the alarming rate of police shootings seem to be on an astronomical rise. Maybe it's all the media at our disposal. I'm not sure. But it does seem to be getting out of hand. Maybe new laws should be enacted? When pulled over, you must shut off your car and you must put your hands out the window. I don't know. Somethings a miss here. Know who that is a standard procedure for? Convicted felons. You and I getting pulled over isn't treated the same as when a known criminal gets pulled over. And that's the way it should be. Police shootings aren't getting out of hand. They happened with the same frequency before. The difference is that now people marching around and pulling the race card gives it national media coverage. Edited December 2, 2015 by echo88 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jessemoore97 1,281 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 Know who that is a standard procedure for? Convicted felons. You and I getting pulled over isn't treated the same as when a known criminal gets pulled over. And that's the way it should be. Police shootings aren't getting out of hand. They happened with the same frequency before. The difference is that now people marching around and pulling the race card gives it national media coverage. +10000. Police shootings are not dramatically on the rise, even if they increased slightly it would be a small statistical blip of maybe a percent or two, and when compared over a longer period of time further prove its insignificance. Besides two of the most highly publicized police deaths had nothing to do with firearms, Gray in Baltimore and the slob in NY who died resisting the officers arrest with the choke-hold that wasn't. People don't understand the sheer volume of calls police respond to each year or the number of times we come into contact with citizens good, bad, or ugly. And out of all those instances and percentage of a percentage end in a violent encounter where someone loses their life. But the media and protesters frame the narrative a different way to skew the bias. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunSlinger 28 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Here's some newly released in car video from a 22 Nov. traffic stop by Northern York Regional Police in southeastern Pa. I live in northeast Pa and knew nothing of this until today, and people wonder why police are on edge when performing what the public and media calls "routine traffic stops". https://youtu.be/Rt5M7TKRJ6w The officer was uninjured and returned fire wounding the suspect in the hand, and is currently on the run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Goblin 114 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 I don't know if you saw that video but that guy was not coming at them in any way. They just unloaded on him in the middle of the road as he walked by. At least the ONLY view I see. Just crazy. Do we not use taser's or batons anymore? This is just not true. The guy was crazy (on drugs) walking around with a knife disobeying orders. The officers were North-West of the perp and the guy started walking North. So while still a few feet West of the officers, he was, IN FACT, getting closer. Its ridiculous for people from the safety of their living room to critique that officer. I bet their trigger finger would be awfully itchy if they were actually there with a knife-wielding maniac getting closer to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDhoosier 1,229 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Disclaimer: I am not claiming this officer is innocent. Based on the video I saw, I would have done something different, but I know first hand not to judge an officer based on limited information. I'm getting off topic here...But are you saying that cops aren't getting enough speciality training that they can't distinguish between firing 6 shots or 16? That regular police stops are becoming the O. K. Corral? That our police forces when faced with any adroitness, are crapping their pants? I guess that's my complaint. Are we asking too much of our police now? The firing of shots may or may not matter in some cases. But the alarming rate of police shootings seem to be on an astronomical rise. Maybe it's all the media at our disposal. I'm not sure. But it does seem to be getting out of hand. Maybe new laws should be enacted? When pulled over, you must shut off your car and you must put your hands out the window. I don't know. Somethings a miss here. I am sorry coltssb, and this is not meant to be offensive at all, but it just seems like you are ignorant on the topic, which majority of the population is. But are you saying that cops aren't getting enough speciality training that they can't distinguish between firing 6 shots or 16? When you are shooting someone in self defense, you do not know how many shots you have fired. If someone tells you differently, they are a range warrior with no actual combat experience. That regular police stops are becoming the O. K. Corral? That our police forces when faced with any adroitness, are crapping their pants? I guess that's my complaint. Are we asking too much of our police now? No, but the media is promoting the idea of disobeying and disrespecting authority figures. When officers come into contact with someone and the person says "**** the police" before the cop evens says anything, the situation is already in hot water and more than likely to escalate to some type of use of force. But the alarming rate of police shootings seem to be on an astronomical rise. Maybe it's all the media at our disposal. Its not on the rise at all, the media is just blasting every African American who is shot by a white cop all over the media. 5 years ago, the Michael Brown case (which sparked this whole thing) would have been nothing more than local news. Maybe new laws should be enacted? When pulled over, you must shut off your car and you must put your hands out the window. I dont make you shut your car off or put your hands out the window. I think it is good etiquette to put your hands on the steering wheel as the officer approaches, but most officers do not order this stuff on a "routine traffic stop." If I know who is in the vehicle and I know they just committed a violent crime or has a felony warrant on file or a history with violence against police, I may order the driver to do that. As for the laws, what laws would help? Do you realize all these protests are similar in one major way? The suspects (not victims) all broke the law and resisted LAWFUL arrest or detainment. How about we teach the public to respect the law and the law enforcement officers. Kids these days laugh at police officers, daring us to do something. For every African American killed by a white cop, there are: - 100x (if not more) African Americans killed by other African Americans - 1000x cops doing great things that go unreported. You know those feel good stories you see on the local news or going through facebook about a cop doing something nice. Those are the ones caught on camera, a cop in your area does something like that almost every day, but they are rarely reported. This media hype is nothing more than criminals escalating the use of force, their families using the race card, and the media trying to start a race war because it gives them good ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stdntDrvr 12 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Disclaimer: I am not claiming this officer is innocent. Based on the video I saw, I would have done something different, but I know first hand not to judge an officer based on limited information. I am sorry coltssb, and this is not meant to be offensive at all, but it just seems like you are ignorant on the topic, which majority of the population is. When you are shooting someone in self defense, you do not know how many shots you have fired. If someone tells you differently, they are a range warrior with no actual combat experience. No, but the media is promoting the idea of disobeying and disrespecting authority figures. When officers come into contact with someone and the person says "**** the police" before the cop evens says anything, the situation is already in hot water and more than likely to escalate to some type of use of force. Its not on the rise at all, the media is just blasting every African American who is shot by a white cop all over the media. 5 years ago, the Michael Brown case (which sparked this whole thing) would have been nothing more than local news. I dont make you shut your car off or put your hands out the window. I think it is good etiquette to put your hands on the steering wheel as the officer approaches, but most officers do not order this stuff on a "routine traffic stop." If I know who is in the vehicle and I know they just committed a violent crime or has a felony warrant on file or a history with violence against police, I may order the driver to do that. As for the laws, what laws would help? Do you realize all these protests are similar in one major way? The suspects (not victims) all broke the law and resisted LAWFUL arrest or detainment. How about we teach the public to respect the law and the law enforcement officers. Kids these days laugh at police officers, daring us to do something. For every African American killed by a white cop, there are: - 100x (if not more) African Americans killed by other African Americans - 1000x cops doing great things that go unreported. You know those feel good stories you see on the local news or going through facebook about a cop doing something nice. Those are the ones caught on camera, a cop in your area does something like that almost every day, but they are rarely reported. This media hype is nothing more than criminals escalating the use of force, their families using the race card, and the media trying to start a race war because it gives them good ratings. Great post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jessemoore97 1,281 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 NDhoosier, great post. To add a bit further to what you said, why add more laws to the books when people question the ones that are already out there and their enforcement. Or are we just passing laws as a feel good measure without actually assessing their value and impact on what you are trying to deter? Gun control is a perfect example of this thinking and unfortunately as I'm typing this there is another mass shooting, and the anti-gun crowd is already getting the ball rolling without having all the facts about the incident. Passing more laws to show that you are doing something is just pandering when those proposals would've done nothing to prevent the senseless violence you're so concerned for and swore to stop. I enforce gun laws, but I watch criminals who I've arrested get slaps on the wrist for firearm involvements. It's a revolving door in the courts for theses offenders, and I guarantee you the fervor expressed by everyone now when these events happen fades away when it comes to the rubber meeting the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianIrish 0 Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 If it was your son, you'd probably be wondering why he was a convicted thug walking around on PCP while brandishing a knife..... Best post in the thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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