The hits keep coming...

[jon33dn 0]

I think we should give the government more powers...

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/05/us-dea-sod-idUSBRE97409R20130805

[echo88 74]

I think we should give the government more powers...

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/05/us-dea-sod-idUSBRE97409R20130805

 

If you think that these re-created cases are anything but a means to ensure that someone caught bringing tons (literally) of cocaine into the U.S. can't just hire a fancy lawyer that gets the charges dismissed, you're wrong. This is clearly unethical, but when your life's work is reduced to letting illegals who are criminals benefit from the freedoms they shouldn't enjoy, I can understand why it's the way it is. They are released, deported, and it's back to figuring out a new way to pollute the rich neighbors to the north for them.

 

It has nothing to do with average, everyday citizens. Just like the NSA's processes.

[nickman54 0]

If you think that these re-created cases are anything but a means to ensure that someone caught bringing tons (literally) of cocaine into the U.S. can't just hire a fancy lawyer that gets the charges dismissed, you're wrong. This is clearly unethical, but when your life's work is reduced to letting illegals who are criminals benefit from the freedoms they shouldn't enjoy, I can understand why it's the way it is. They are released, deported, and it's back to figuring out a new way to pollute the rich neighbors to the north for them.

 

It has nothing to do with average, everyday citizens. Just like the NSA's processes.

 

The .gov is our friend and they will help us, as long as we obey. :der:

[echo88 74]

The .gov is our friend and they will help us, as long as we obey. :der:

 

You don't get it. These efforts, all of them, are in an effort to rid ourselves of terrorists and cartel criminals who get to benefit from the same freedoms as everyday Americans. Sorry if you disagree, but I don't think either group deserves the same protection as you and I. When you're caught running drugs across our borders or running a foiled terrorist attack, you should be ferried off for a 5 minute hearing before catching a bullet to the temple--not living 20+ years in a luxe prison while my tax dollars pay for your cable service....

[jon33dn 0]

You don't get it. These efforts, all of them, are in an effort to rid ourselves of terrorists and cartel criminals who get to benefit from the same freedoms as everyday Americans. Sorry if you disagree, but I don't think either group deserves the same protection as you and I. When you're caught running drugs across our borders or running a foiled terrorist attack, you should be ferried off for a 5 minute hearing before catching a bullet to the temple--not living 20+ years in a luxe prison while my tax dollars pay for your cable service....

 

You might have a point, but we are talking about the same government that has used it power to thwart political opposition in an election year... those protections that are an inconvenience to your sensibilities are our only protection against a government capable of almost anything.

[echo88 74]

You might have a point, but we are talking about the same government that has used it power to thwart political opposition in an election year... those protections that are an inconvenience to your sensibilities are our only protection against a government capable of almost anything.

 

Sorry man, but please realize this instance of fabricating evidence to secure a conviction is employed virtually every day by small down police departments. Lawmen know that our justice system is flawed and the only way to nail down a criminal (even ones who confess) is an arduous game. The only difference in this case is that the DEA is using it to convict the worst kind of criminals---the ones who aren't citizens, don't want to be here, and whose sole purpose is trafficking mega amounts of narcotics to even bigger shitheads stateside...F em....

[ND3 0]

In summary-- The Government, through the NSA and a division of the DEA called the Special Operations Divisions (SOD) are using warrant-less wiretaps and illegal communication intercepts to tip-off Federal Law enforcement on what to do and where to be and who to stop and search.

 

This is illegal, and they know it. So they get around it by doing something called "Parallel Construction". They make-up or invent a 'background investigation', that then creates legal and satisfactory justification for the stop they made with (what was really) illegally obtained information. They use the made-up or invented 'background investigation' to leap the typical safeguards and legal tests required for admissibility of evidence in any subsequent trial.

 

I am not a fan of the "slippery slope" argument because it usually requires erroneous extrapolation and is really only meant to spread fear, but I do think it is apt here.

 

Catching criminals is good. Smuggling huge amounts of drugs into the US is bad. Of course they should be caught and captured, but it's absurd that law enforcement can completely disregard the laws that they are supposed to follow. It can get out of hand, fast.

 

The "check" on the power of the NSA is a secret court. Every official who has ever discussed secret surveillance has lied to us. It is not being used for counter-terrorism only. Now it's expanded to support this ridiculous drug war (which is another issue entirely).

 

So in addition to circumventing the 4th and 9th Amendments, we now have proof of circumventing the 6th. Our elected leaders are in charge of these programs. They took an oath of office. They swore to uphold the Constitution and subsequently treated it like toilet paper. I, for one, cannot trust them any longer. Power is intoxicating, and I'm afraid of how far this does and will go.

 

The National Security Agency does not listen to Americans’ phone calls and it is not reading Americans’ emails. None of these programs allow that.

 

-Rep. Mike Rogers, chair of House Intelligence Committee - http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/06/intelligence-committee-leaders-defend-nsa-surveillance/

 

XKeyscore, the documents boast, is the NSA's "widest reaching" system developing intelligence from computer networks – what the agency calls Digital Network Intelligence (DNI). One presentation claims the program covers "nearly everything a typical user does on the internet", including the content of emails, websites visited and searches, as well as their metadata.

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/nsa-documents-about-xkeyscore-search-tool-2013-7

 

We've been lied to and duped. Think long and hard about who you vote for in 2014 and 2016.

[AlabamaDuck 0]

Watch what you say, you are being recorded.

[TheRizz 5]

I would encourage people read about the beginnings of WWII. The same economic, religious, and civil liberties are being attacked. And, the same media mash isn't covering them. Instead, the media is helping to promote the attack on liberties. It's actually remarkably parallel.

[VCDomer 68]

You don't get it. These efforts, all of them, are in an effort to rid ourselves of terrorists and cartel criminals who get to benefit from the same freedoms as everyday Americans. Sorry if you disagree, but I don't think either group deserves the same protection as you and I. When you're caught running drugs across our borders or running a foiled terrorist attack, you should be ferried off for a 5 minute hearing before catching a bullet to the temple--not living 20+ years in a luxe prison while my tax dollars pay for your cable service....

 

That's 4.5 seconds too long! Why the delay?

[VCDomer 68]

In summary-- The Government, through the NSA and a division of the DEA called the Special Operations Divisions (SOD) are using warrant-less wiretaps and illegal communication intercepts to tip-off Federal Law enforcement on what to do and where to be and who to stop and search.

 

This is illegal, and they know it. So they get around it by doing something called "Parallel Construction". They make-up or invent a 'background investigation', that then creates legal and satisfactory justification for the stop they made with (what was really) illegally obtained information. They use the made-up or invented 'background investigation' to leap the typical safeguards and legal tests required for admissibility of evidence in any subsequent trial.

 

I am not a fan of the "slippery slope" argument because it usually requires erroneous extrapolation and is really only meant to spread fear, but I do think it is apt here.

 

Catching criminals is good. Smuggling huge amounts of drugs into the US is bad. Of course they should be caught and captured, but it's absurd that law enforcement can completely disregard the laws that they are supposed to follow. It can get out of hand, fast.

The "check" on the power of the NSA is a secret court. Every official who has ever discussed secret surveillance has lied to us. It is not being used for counter-terrorism only. Now it's expanded to support this ridiculous drug war (which is another issue entirely).

 

So in addition to circumventing the 4th and 9th Amendments, we now have proof of circumventing the 6th. Our elected leaders are in charge of these programs. They took an oath of office. They swore to uphold the Constitution and subsequently treated it like toilet paper. I, for one, cannot trust them any longer. Power is intoxicating, and I'm afraid of how far this does and will go.

 

 

 

-Rep. Mike Rogers, chair of House Intelligence Committee - http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/06/intelligence-committee-leaders-defend-nsa-surveillance/

 

 

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/nsa-documents-about-xkeyscore-search-tool-2013-7

 

We've been lied to and duped. Think long and hard about who you vote for in 2014 and 2016.

 

Buford Pusser would disagree with you.

[echo88 74]

In summary-- The Government, through the NSA and a division of the DEA called the Special Operations Divisions (SOD) are using warrant-less wiretaps and illegal communication intercepts to tip-off Federal Law enforcement on what to do and where to be and who to stop and search.

 

This is illegal, and they know it. So they get around it by doing something called "Parallel Construction". They make-up or invent a 'background investigation', that then creates legal and satisfactory justification for the stop they made with (what was really) illegally obtained information. They use the made-up or invented 'background investigation' to leap the typical safeguards and legal tests required for admissibility of evidence in any subsequent trial.

 

I am not a fan of the "slippery slope" argument because it usually requires erroneous extrapolation and is really only meant to spread fear, but I do think it is apt here.

 

Catching criminals is good. Smuggling huge amounts of drugs into the US is bad. Of course they should be caught and captured, but it's absurd that law enforcement can completely disregard the laws that they are supposed to follow. It can get out of hand, fast.

 

The "check" on the power of the NSA is a secret court. Every official who has ever discussed secret surveillance has lied to us. It is not being used for counter-terrorism only. Now it's expanded to support this ridiculous drug war (which is another issue entirely).

 

So in addition to circumventing the 4th and 9th Amendments, we now have proof of circumventing the 6th. Our elected leaders are in charge of these programs. They took an oath of office. They swore to uphold the Constitution and subsequently treated it like toilet paper. I, for one, cannot trust them any longer. Power is intoxicating, and I'm afraid of how far this does and will go.

 

 

 

-Rep. Mike Rogers, chair of House Intelligence Committee - http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/06/intelligence-committee-leaders-defend-nsa-surveillance/

 

 

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/nsa-documents-about-xkeyscore-search-tool-2013-7

 

We've been lied to and duped. Think long and hard about who you vote for in 2014 and 2016.

 

Way, way off base. It is absolutely only used for counter-terrorism. I know. You don't. Do you know why the "secret court" is needed? Because if it wasn't a cleared court, then the public would have access to our sources and methods for identifying and catching terrorists. Know who is part of "the public"? Terrorists. They live here. They take advantage of the arduous process required for approval to listen to anything. Of course public officials have lied about the programs. It's classified so guess what---you have to lie about it. They don't lie about it because they are worried about what the public thinks. They lie about it so that our targets don't get a confirmation on how we use information to identify them. I think that is probably the biggest misconception about this whole NSA story.

 

Your emails, your calls, your internet searches....none of that will ever reach a secret courtroom because your profile and patterns don't fit that of a terrorist. So in other words, there isn't anything you are doing that is being tracked....or watched. They're actually quite easy to pick out, assuming an excessive amount of time and resources aren't spent explaining to the un-cleared general public how this is helping to keep them safe.

Edited August 6, 2013 by echo88

[piratey 6]

Way, way off base. It is absolutely only used for counter-terrorism. I know. You don't. Do you know why the "secret court" is needed? Because if it wasn't a cleared court, then the public would have access to our sources and methods for identifying and catching terrorists. Know who is part of "the public"? Terrorists. They live here. They take advantage of the arduous process required for approval to listen to anything. Of course public officials have lied about the programs. It's classified so guess what---you have to lie about it. They don't lie about it because they are worried about what the public thinks. They lie about it so that our targets don't get a confirmation on how we use information to identify them. I think that is probably the biggest misconception about this whole NSA story.

 

Your emails, your calls, your internet searches....none of that will ever reach a secret courtroom because your profile and patterns don't fit that of a terrorist. So in other words, there isn't anything you are doing that is being tracked....or watched. They're actually quite easy to pick out, assuming an excessive amount of time and resources aren't spent explaining to the un-cleared general public how this is helping to keep them safe.

 

http://i.imgur.com/XrxMc.gif

 

Yeah. Sure. And social media sites don't sell your information. Sorry but I just don't buy it. And that's what we are being told, "Oh don't worry, trust us when we say you can trust us, we won't do anything nefarious with this information. We promise."

 

 

Like I believe a time won't come that elections and decisions aren't influenced by the contents of what is being collected. Trust them?

http://i.imgur.com/Agci8.gif

[echo88 74]

http://i.imgur.com/XrxMc.gif

 

Yeah. Sure. And social media sites don't sell your information. Sorry but I just don't buy it. And that's what we are being told, "Oh don't worry, trust us when we say you can trust us, we won't do anything nefarious with this information. We promise."

 

 

Like I believe a time won't come that elections and decisions aren't influenced by the contents of what is being collected. Trust them?

http://i.imgur.com/Agci8.gif

 

Social media sites don't sell anything. They are served with a legal requirement to hand over information on persons who are believed to be tied to terrorism. So yeah, when the public hears this they are thinking everyone's data is being handed over to the government and it's simply not true. Terrorists use social media to communicate with one another and it's usually in an attempt to obfuscate their activities. This is the point that keeps getting ignored---when data is exchanged between social media legal departments and the government, it's data that belongs to someone who has fired off several red flags already. Not you or I.

 

As for the trust thing, Im not sure I understand the alternative. When we have very sensitive mechanisms in place to identify and catch terrorists, don't you understand that if the public is aware of them then so is the adversary??

 

If you know of a way to have some giant town hall meeting where we let everyone in on how we go about doing things without letting it get out to the threats then please let me know. When information like that gets out to the public, the outrage from citizens pales in comparison to the harm it causes to our ability to do our jobs and find the bad guys.

 

The extremely valuable information that can be harvested from their FB and Twitter accounts is now a lost cause. Now they won't use it anymore. They will adapt just like they always do and find a new way to communicate....and plan....and carry our attacks. The information of law abiding citizens who aren't tied to terrorism has never been in danger of being unlawfully intercepted or viewed--that is being ignored. The public is assuming that just because the government can request data from a social media account, it automatically means their information isn't safe.

[ND3 0]

Way, way off base. It is absolutely only used for counter-terrorism. I know. You don't. Do you know why the "secret court" is needed? Because if it wasn't a cleared court, then the public would have access to our sources and methods for identifying and catching terrorists. Know who is part of "the public"? Terrorists. They live here. They take advantage of the arduous process required for approval to listen to anything. Of course public officials have lied about the programs. It's classified so guess what---you have to lie about it. They don't lie about it because they are worried about what the public thinks. They lie about it so that our targets don't get a confirmation on how we use information to identify them. I think that is probably the biggest misconception about this whole NSA story.

 

Your emails, your calls, your internet searches....none of that will ever reach a secret courtroom because your profile and patterns don't fit that of a terrorist. So in other words, there isn't anything you are doing that is being tracked....or watched. They're actually quite easy to pick out, assuming an excessive amount of time and resources aren't spent explaining to the un-cleared general public how this is helping to keep them safe.

 

Drug smugglers are now included under the umbrella of "terrorists"? When did that happen?

 

That's the thing about this "War on Terror". It's a war against an idea. You can't win. You can, however, continue to change/expand the definition of "terrorist" to include whatever you want and create a never-ending war.

 

So if this information is only used for counter-terrorism, and it's used in conjunction with the DEA to catch drug smugglers, then, by deductive reasoning, the War on Drugs is part of the War on Terror. And just like that, the definition of "terrorist" expands. The 2012 NDAA expanded the definition to include American citizens, as well.

 

Come on, any legitimite threat to the United States has spies and knows exactly how we gather data. Acting like they don't is foolish. If cartels are hiring American soldiers as hitmen for $5000 per hit, it's not unreasonable to assume that al Qaeda is hiring Americans with top-secret clearance for information. Half a million private contractors have top-secret clearance! That means they are already in it for profit, not national security.

 

All these people with all this sensitive information- somebody will tell secrets. People have a price.

[echo88 74]

Drug smugglers are now included under the umbrella of "terrorists"? When did that happen?

 

That's the thing about this "War on Terror". It's a war against an idea. You can't win. You can, however, continue to change/expand the definition of "terrorist" to include whatever you want and create a never-ending war.

 

So if this information is only used for counter-terrorism, and it's used in conjunction with the DEA to catch drug smugglers, then, by deductive reasoning, the War on Drugs is part of the War on Terror. And just like that, the definition of "terrorist" expands. The 2012 NDAA expanded the definition to include American citizens, as well.

 

Come on, any legitimite threat to the United States has spies and knows exactly how we gather data. Acting like they don't is foolish. If cartels are hiring American soldiers as hitmen for $5000 per hit, it's not unreasonable to assume that al Qaeda is hiring Americans with top-secret clearance for information. Half a million private contractors have top-secret clearance! That means they are already in it for profit, not national security.

 

All these people with all this sensitive information- somebody will tell secrets. People have a price.

 

This just shows how very little you know about classified information and how it is protected. Unlike a hired gun, you would have to find someone very specific within the organization. You can't just walk up to someone with a TS and offer money for information. Hell, guys who work with anti-aircraft radars have TS clearances. You'd have to find someone with specific read-ons, or caveats, for the information you want. It is heavily, heavily compartmentalized. Maybe a handful of people in a sea of tens of thousands. Oh, and you'd also have to find someone who could easily pass periodic polygraph exams when lying....multiple times. Then you'd have to find someone who knows how to hide their finances, since part of the agreement for having this clearance requires you to offer unfettered access into your private life--including any and all money.

 

Good luck with that. And no, my statement wasn't related to the war on drugs. It was directed to another poster's lack of trust with the govt.

[piratey 6]

Social media sites don't sell anything. They are served with a legal requirement to hand over information on persons who are believed to be tied to terrorism. .

 

To be honest nothing that followed this statement had any validity. Because you're completely off base.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2212178/New-privacy-row-Facebook-begins-selling-access-users-boost-ailing-profits.html

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303302504577327744009046230.html

 

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100324379

 

http://rt.com/news/twitter-sells-tweet-archive-529/

 

To sum up: Facebook sells your info to advertisers, facebook apps take your info and sell it, Twitter sells deleted tweets, private messages and protected tweets, Instagram can sell your pictures.

 

The information is out there to track everything you do and everywhere you go. Your cellphone tracks your movement, your car tracks your movement. Your TV can watch you. Your computer can watch you. Your cell phone can listen in on you. Your internet activity shows your interests. All of this is going into one big database. Someone, somewhere, is getting paid to create a program to effectively filter and sort this information. And we're just going to let it happen because it's already happening.

 

http://illinoispolicy.org/uploads/media/huxley.png

 

If this doesn't scare you, then you are willingly signing away your freedom 5-10 years from now. Big brother is coming.

Edited August 6, 2013 by piratey

[echo88 74]

To be honest nothing that followed this statement had any validity. Because you're completely off base.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2212178/New-privacy-row-Facebook-begins-selling-access-users-boost-ailing-profits.html

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303302504577327744009046230.html

 

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100324379

 

http://rt.com/news/twitter-sells-tweet-archive-529/

 

To sum up: Facebook sells your info to advertisers, facebook apps take your info and sell it, Twitter sells deleted tweets, private messages and protected tweets, Instagram can sell your pictures.

 

The information is out there to track everything you do and everywhere you go. Your cellphone tracks your movement, your car tracks your movement. Your TV can watch you. Your computer can watch you. Your cell phone can listen in on you. Your internet activity shows your interests. All of this is going into one big database. Someone, somewhere, is getting paid to create a program to effectively filter and sort this information. And we're just going to let it happen because it's already happening.

 

http://illinoispolicy.org/uploads/media/huxley.png

 

If this doesn't scare you, then you are willingly signing away your freedom 5-10 years from now. Big brother is coming.

 

Well then you should've kept reading, because everything that was written after that was based on the assumption that you were referring to social media selling your information to the govt.----not the private sector....

 

As for your conspiracy theory, I can't help you there. If you think anyone is after that information for any reason beyond increasing the chances of making money, you're wrong. And I hate to put a damper on your outlook, but your cellphone, tv, car, computer, etc. dont track anything. The network that is hosting the items does. The items are simply the vehicle used. I guess the only safe bet is to disregard the progression of modern technology and hide under your bed.

[echo88 74]

That's 4.5 minutes too long! Why the delay?

 

 

Fixed it for you.

[nickman54 0]

If we actually had an immigration policy in this country that discouraged illegal entry most of our problems would go away.

 

How in the hell do we allow two douchebags from kazadoucheissatan to come into Boston and mame and kill all of those people?? Even the godamn Ruskys told us to keep an eye on these dicks, but our big brother .gov let those people down. The damn Russians hate us, but still gave us a warning. Hell, we gave them welfare. Unreal. Try to defend that stupid ****.