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Embarrassed for ND football


NDLincPark

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They are going to trot out a QB who has three passing TDs in his last 10  games. 

Spanning 243 passing attempts, the guy has thrown 3 Tds over two seasons

Yet, the Fighting Irish seemingly are unable to make a change to better, or they are afraid to do it. 

In his last 5 games(3 at ND), he has thrown 0 Tds, 4 Ints, and had around a 53% completion %.   

 

Is there another top 150 ranked program in the country that would be OK with this level of anti-production?   

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Golly.

Are there many P-5 schools that have a record better that 21-8 over the 2022, 2023, and 2024 seasons?  I honestly don't know and am too lazy to do the research.

To me, winning trumps passing TD's, regardless of the school.

That's not to say I love having Leonard being the starting QB at ND, or that I have loved having the rent-a-QB system ND has had over the last few years.  But they do tend to win.

Is it going to bring a championship?  Not this year for sure, but neither would starting Carr bring a championship this year.  Getting Carr meaningful reps will pay off, and hopefully ND can do that in a lot of games this year.

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15 minutes ago, AnTostal said:

Golly.

Are there many P-5 schools that have a record better that 21-8 over the 2022, 2023, and 2024 seasons?  I honestly don't know and am too lazy to do the research.

To me, winning trumps passing TD's, regardless of the school.

That's not to say I love having Leonard being the starting QB at ND, or that I have loved having the rent-a-QB system ND has had over the last few years.  But they do tend to win.

Is it going to bring a championship?  Not this year for sure, but neither would starting Carr bring a championship this year.  Getting Carr meaningful reps will pay off, and hopefully ND can do that in a lot of games this year.

 

SWAC / MAC schools would move on from a QB as putrid as Leonard.  Why does ND keep setting the bar so low?

 

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It comes down to a philosophical difference on the role of a QB.

Some say the QB is successful when he leads the team and wins games

Others say, The QB needs to hit statistical benchmarks AND win games

 

Tony Rice and Riley Leonard match-up fine statistically

Joe Montana and Riley, not in the ballpark, But Joe lost plenty of games at ND too.

 

What do Tony Rice and Joe Montana have in common

Joe Led the 77 Irish to a National title with 1 early loss I believe

Tony led the 88 Irish to a National Title.

 

So to me there are many ways to get to the same goal.

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12 minutes ago, FaithInIrish Forever said:

 

Tony Rice and Riley Leonard match-up fine statistically. 

The glaring difference to me is completions of long passes. Rice often completed long bombs to Ricky Watters and The Rocket. Some of this was possible because Holtz's run game was so relentless that teams had to single cover Watters/Rocket without a deep safety and some of it was that Rice had a strong arm to launch the ball far downfield. 

 

Since Denbrock's run offense is not as relentless, Leonard is being asked to throw deep with a single safety backing up man coverage. Denbrock designed a play against Purdue in man coverage where Love was being covered by a linebacker and Love ran the route on the numbers so the safety would not have been a factor. For some reason Leonard didn't throw the ball. I'm not sure why, but I don't think Leonard's arm is as strong as Rice's. If this offense is going to be truly dangerous, Leonard has got to make that throw just as Rice did. 

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1 minute ago, Frankus said:

The glaring difference to me is completions of long passes. Rice often completed long bombs to Ricky Watters and The Rocket. Some of this was possible because Holtz's run game was so relentless that teams had to single cover Watters/Rocket without a deep safety and some of it was that Rice had a strong arm to launch the ball far downfield. 

 

Since Denbrock's run offense is not as relentless, Leonard is being asked to throw deep with a single safety backing up man coverage. Denbrock designed a play against Purdue in man coverage where Love was being covered by a linebacker and Love ran the route on the numbers so the safety would not have been a factor. For some reason Leonard didn't throw the ball. I'm not sure why, but I don't think Leonard's arm is as strong as Rice's. If this offense is going to be truly dangerous, Leonard has got to make that throw just as Rice did. 

Agreed. Rice to TE(help with the tight ends name please. Etc.)I also acknowledge you legitimately know more about football than I ever will.

 

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24 minutes ago, FaithInIrish Forever said:

Agreed. Rice to TE(help with the tight ends name please. Etc.)I also acknowledge you legitimately know more about football than I ever will.

 

I didn't see a TE pass. The crossing route to #40 was running back Tony Brooks. 

The second play in this highlight is the kind of pass Rice did complete. He had a strong arm. 

https://youtu.be/6nwIe-trahs?si=E1PvfqN9q_fP1IbM

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Frankus said:

I didn't see a TE pass. The crossing route to #40 was running back Tony Brooks. 

The second play in this highlight is the kind of pass Rice did complete. He had a strong arm. 

 

https://youtu.be/6nwIe-trahs?si=8LCJHG8gnN5c69zv

 

 

I wanna say Derek Brown but I'm not sure it was this game. I know he got one to Rocket early there

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11 minutes ago, FaithInIrish Forever said:

I wanna say Derek Brown but I'm not sure it was this game. I know he got one to Rocket early there

Yes, the big TE was Derek Brown. Rocket, Watters and Brown were all elite players,  and Holtz's running attack was so relentless that it opened up the long bomb passing game as an additional threat that made the offense very difficult to defend and very good. 

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No one can answer my question.

Why does ND continue to devalue the QB position, and set the bar so low for what they want from the position?

'Play like a Champion today, unless you're our QB, then play like a MAC QB Today' 

That should be the new sign

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40 minutes ago, NDLincPark said:

No one can answer my question.

Why does ND continue to devalue the QB position, and set the bar so low for what they want from the position?

'Play like a Champion today, unless you're our QB, then play like a MAC QB Today' 

That should be the new sign

So you are suggesting they start Carr now and move on from Riley Leonard?  I am just trying to figure out what you are trying to get answered.

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48 minutes ago, NDLincPark said:

No one can answer my question.

Why does ND continue to devalue the QB position, and set the bar so low for what they want from the position?

'Play like a Champion today, unless you're our QB, then play like a MAC QB Today' 

That should be the new sign

I guess I am trying to understand how and why you feel there is a better option in the QB room, yet the coaching staff refuses to play the better player.  Riley is having trouble throwing down field.  We all agree on that.  Dude just had 100 yards and 3 touchdowns on the ground in the first half alone.  Will they beat a big time program if hew cant throw?  Probably not.  Will they beat a big time program with any of the other three guys right now?  probably not.  So to bench Riley now and "Play for the future" is basically telling the guys who returned...Sorry you came back guys but we aren't going to try this year.  have fun as your NFL draft stock plumets.  Not a good look for a coaching staff in my opinion.  

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44 minutes ago, NDLincPark said:

No one can answer my question.

Why does ND continue to devalue the QB position, and set the bar so low for what they want from the position?

Hmmm.  ND 'devalues' the QB position, and they set the bar low.  It's clearly your opinion they do that, and there is no doubt that ND has not had a truly great QB for a few decades now.  No. Doubt.

But, that's not because ND actually devalues the QB position.  They haven't been able to get a great QB because they devalue the position?  Nah.  Lots of reasons, but not that.

Does ND set the bar low?  Doesn't seem like it to me.  But, again, there's no doubt they haven't had an amazing QB in quite a while.

I'm not here to answer a question.  I  think the premise of your question is incorrect.  But I also agree that ND has not been able to field a major QB talent for decades.  There are lots of reasons for that, I am confident.

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3 minutes ago, AnTostal said:

Hmmm.  ND 'devalues' the QB position, and they set the bar low.  It's clearly your opinion they do that, and there is no doubt that ND has not had a truly great QB for a few decades now.  No. Doubt.

But, that's not because ND actually devalues the QB position.  They haven't been able to get a great QB because they devalue the position?  Nah.  Lots of reasons, but not that.

Does ND set the bar low?  Doesn't seem like it to me.  But, again, there's no doubt they haven't had an amazing QB in quite a while.

I'm not here to answer a question.  I  think the premise of your question is incorrect.  But I also agree that ND has not been able to field a major QB talent for decades.  There are lots of reasons for that, I am confident.

Would 'Insert any top 50 program in the country' start a Qb who has 3 Tds, 5 Ints, a 57% completion %, and has lost to NUI in his last 10 games?  No, they wouldnt.  

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