Watched ALOT of bowl games this weekend 10 years ago the trend the Spread it out, run the QB, pass out of empty

Now the trend is go into the pistol with 2 and 3 tight ends, motion them late and run the ball behind them DOWN HILL, 12 or 13 personnel 

QB: 20 passes or less

 

2 hours ago, FaithInIrishForever said:

Watched ALOT of bowl games this weekend 10 years ago the trend the Spread it out, run the QB, pass out of empty

Now the trend is go into the pistol with 2 and 3 tight ends, motion them late and run the ball behind them DOWN HILL, 12 or 13 personnel 

QB: 20 passes or less

 

Just a guess. Back then, the top teams relied on the run and pound the little guys. Then App State happened and the big guys realized that they needed speed and that the spread does just that, spreads them out and they struggle to keep up. Well, now the powerhouse teams are getting the most talented sped guys but are overlooking the power. Leaving the lower teams to rebuild and slow the game down against better teams. This is just my opinion but I figured this would go full circle. The same way I kept saying Fleck is doing it right. I assume that we’ll start seeing teams slowly going back to more run vs the pass. Also, so hard to evaluate “5 “ star qb’s. I think it’s easier to look at o-linemen and build around that. 

Just now, coltssb said:

Just a guess. Back then, the top teams relied on the run and pound the little guys. Then App State happened and the big guys realized that they needed speed and that the spread does just that, spreads them out and they struggle to keep up. Well, now the powerhouse teams are getting the most talented sped guys but are overlooking the power. Leaving the lower teams to rebuild and slow the game down against better teams. This is just my opinion but I figured this would go full circle. The same way I kept saying Fleck is doing it right. I assume that we’ll start seeing teams slowly going back to more run vs the pass. Also, so hard to evaluate “5 “ star qb’s. I think it’s easier to look at o-linemen and build around that. 

Thats exactly it. Its funny you mention App State. They were in 12 or 13 personnel today in their bowl loss. 10 years ago they would of had a qb who ran read option, now they have a "power" play-action pistol offense. They ran up against an Air-raid today and just got outscored.

it really does come full circle.

It still makes me shudder that people think running the ball with clock management is too old school and not with the times.  A vertical threat is a nice feature to have in an offense but the personnel has to be there too.  This is why it is extremely important for an OC and HC to be on the same page understanding who they have as much as running their scheme.  To be successful you need to make those mesh together while also being able to adjust to the ebb and flow of each game.  Running games aren't caveman football in their simplistic way of execution.  There are sophisticated rushing attacks that are very effective.  

There's room for multiple styles of offense out there.  I love leaning on the run game with double TE packages which really open up pop passes and the TE seams when defenses stack the box.

In line with this, over the weekend a high school in Texas won the state title game with zero passes and over 500 yards rushing.

 

22 minutes ago, jessemoore97 said:

It still makes me shudder that people think running the ball with clock management is too old school and not with the times.  A vertical threat is a nice feature to have in an offense but the personnel has to be there too.  This is why it is extremely important for an OC and HC to be on the same page understanding who they have as much as running their scheme.  To be successful you need to make those mesh together while also being able to adjust to the ebb and flow of each game.  Running games aren't caveman football in their simplistic way of execution.  There are sophisticated rushing attacks that are very effective.  

There's room for multiple styles of offense out there.  I love leaning on the run game with double TE packages which really open up pop passes and the TE seams when defenses stack the box.

There's absolutely room for multiple styles. But you have to have some type of balance if you want to win the big prize, or the big game. Balance between O and D. Balance between running and passing, and balance between pass D and run D. UGA is a great example of great run O, great D, but can't get it done. Also takes coaching/play-calling. And it takes a bit of planets aligning and recruiting. It's all a fun recipe. 

ND shops at a store without some ingredients, so they have to hit bigger in other areas. 

It's almost as if Tommy has some foresight.. hmm.... 

8 hours ago, OKelleyIrish said:

There's absolutely room for multiple styles. But you have to have some type of balance if you want to win the big prize, or the big game. Balance between O and D. Balance between running and passing, and balance between pass D and run D. UGA is a great example of great run O, great D, but can't get it done. Also takes coaching/play-calling. And it takes a bit of planets aligning and recruiting. It's all a fun recipe. 

ND shops at a store without some ingredients, so they have to hit bigger in other areas. 

Was watching Urban Meyer on youtube yesterday, he was working for Big Ten Network at the time.

Just to put a tangible number on it offensively.

He wanted:

250 yards rushing, 250 yards passing at the end of each game

If you watch any dominant team in college football they can produce that

 

My standard for watching defense these days is

less than 20 points

more than 5 tackles for loss

forcing turnovers

3 or more sacks

not sure on a yardage standard need to look at what the top defenses give up

able to stop the run

able to stop the pass

 

So ND is short o standard on offense, closer on defense

It’s evolving and revolving.

the more it changes the more it stays the same.

Chip Kelly out of Oregon who ran smash mouth with 4 receivers was a huge innovation now teams are doing the opposite with versatile TE.

teams wanna get you in sub personnel on defense and exploit your weakness.. most teams have built defenses to play faster with their base d so if they can get you to sub heavy they can hit you with athletic TE or if you stay in base you’re gonna have a tough time stopping the run if the extra TE can run block. 

9 hours ago, OKelleyIrish said:

There's absolutely room for multiple styles. But you have to have some type of balance if you want to win the big prize, or the big game. Balance between O and D. Balance between running and passing, and balance between pass D and run D. UGA is a great example of great run O, great D, but can't get it done. Also takes coaching/play-calling. And it takes a bit of planets aligning and recruiting. It's all a fun recipe. 

ND shops at a store without some ingredients, so they have to hit bigger in other areas. 

Isn’t that the way it is for every team and every sports besides the Yankees and Dodgers etc. The old  St. Louis Cardinals used to run. Wisky likes to pound to compete. Golden State uses a small lineup most of the time. 
Again, ND is just fine with top 5-8 classes. But they need to have an identity and a dominant qb. 

On 12/19/2021 at 1:05 PM, coltssb said:

Isn’t that the way it is for every team and every sports besides the Yankees and Dodgers etc. The old  St. Louis Cardinals used to run. Wisky likes to pound to compete. Golden State uses a small lineup most of the time. 
Again, ND is just fine with top 5-8 classes. But they need to have an identity and a dominant qb. 

Planets aligning. 

On 12/19/2021 at 11:04 AM, JTennant said:

It’s evolving and revolving.

the more it changes the more it stays the same.

Chip Kelly out of Oregon who ran smash mouth with 4 receivers was a huge innovation now teams are doing the opposite with versatile TE.

teams wanna get you in sub personnel on defense and exploit your weakness.. most teams have built defenses to play faster with their base d so if they can get you to sub heavy they can hit you with athletic TE or if you stay in base you’re gonna have a tough time stopping the run if the extra TE can run block. 

Agree with this. Offenses went spread and speed. Defenses had to react so recruited smaller and faster players. Now most defenses are built for speed so power offenses will have success. The whole cycle probably takes 10-12 years to come full Circle.

25 minutes ago, SDIrishFan said:

Agree with this. Offenses went spread and speed. Defenses had to react so recruited smaller and faster players. Now most defenses are built for speed so power offenses will have success. The whole cycle probably takes 10-12 years to come full Circle.

I thought that was why Wisconsin and Stanford (until recently) had success above their recruiting. They had run first O's with actual fullbacks and were something that other teams did not see much of and, as a result, did not have the personnel on defense to defend against.

Edited December 24, 20213 yr by jbrown_9999