I will say it now, Coan will cost us a game if we don’t make this switch and I hope it’s not the Cincinnati game it costs us. We saw this movie in 2018, Wimbush almost cost us a few games but we made the switch before it was too late and the rest is history. 
 

With the way this team is currently constructed, Pyne gives us the best chance to win. He has a quicker release and is more decisive than Coan. He’s also much more athletic, has better pocket awareness and accuracy. Coan is a bad fit for this offence and the offence looked so much better with Pyne. There were even more running lanes because the threat of him running held the backers for just that split second. 
 

We don’t owe Coan anything, he’s a solid QB but you do realize Wisky chose Mertz over him. Yes we are 4-0 but we are 4-0 despite him. This team is very talented, however we could just as easily be 0-4 and our schedule hasn’t been murders row. 
 

Can anyone make a solid argument for Coan? I’m starting to question what the coaches are watching in practice? We’ve seen backups look better under Kelly before. There’s enough tape on Coan to know you can’t win a title with him. That’s the goal for Kelly isn’t it? In the small sample I saw today from Pyne, he showed more potential than Coan has ever flashed and it isn’t close. 
 

Really hope we don’t make this change before it’s too late because we know this line isn’t improving under Quinn and it is for that reason I think this change will be inevitable. 

With this O-line, I have to seriously ask, if Buchner is a no-go again this week (Hammy issues can take surprisingly long to resolve) who is behind Pyne?

If our QB is going to get sacked 5x a half… no QB is safe here.

Just now, Green Goblin said:

With this O-line, I have to seriously ask, if Buchner is a no-go again this week (Hammy issues can take surprisingly long to resolve) who is behind Pyne?

If our QB is going to get sacked 5x a half… no QB is safe here.

Avery Davis could still do it. I know you think I'm nuts but he threw that 2 point conversion. Powlus is also hurt.

Why is the assumption that Coan has a stronger arm? From the little I saw yesterday, to me it seemed like Pyne had more “zip” on his passes than anything I’ve seen from Coan this year. Didn’t really see any deep balls so I can’t comment on that.

To me it’s consistency. Coan will Have a great drive, then 4 straight crappers. I’m not expecting points every drive, especially against better teams, but multiple 3 and outs in a row kills our defense.

Doesnt help we have ZERO run game but that is what it is. We’re a pass first offense.

Not sure I have an answer at this point as far as which QB gives us the best chance to win this season.

Get well soon Tyler!

While I have been on the switch to Buchner band wagon I will say that they all will have struggles.  The line seems to not look as bad when we have a QB in who can shift the pocket or roll out quickly which Coan clearly can't do.  However, I am seeing a lot of routes where the receievers are not getting open or good separation.  If Coan is going to be the guy then play calling has to change to a quick passing game.  If he holds it longer then two seconds he is going to  get hit. While I will concede he holds the ball to much you also have to admit the play calling is not getting the ball out quick enough.  

I am for going to one of the young guys purely to get their experience level up.  If some how BK gets 10 wins this season then it would be a heck of a job between the roster turnover, new D system, and a tough schedule.

Boy this is tough. I see both side of this debate. I think we all agree that the Oline is pathetic (especially at left tackle) and the primary problem. Unless we can fix this, it will not much matter who takes snaps. As it currently stands I say we start Coan, but if we see problems with Coan’s mobility paired with significant pressure …. Pull him for Pyne or Buchner. The bottom line is we need mobility and a quick release right now until the line improves. This should also be the message to our inept offensive coordinator. 

37 minutes ago, VCDomer said:

Boy this is tough. I see both side of this debate. I think we all agree that the Oline is pathetic (especially at left tackle) and the primary problem. Unless we can fix this, it will not much matter who takes snaps. As it currently stands I say we start Coan, but if we see problems with Coan’s mobility paired with significant pressure …. Pull him for Pyne or Buchner. The bottom line is we need mobility and a quick release right now until the line improves. This should also be the message to our inept offensive coordinator. 

This hasn’t been mentioned much but have you seen an offence that looks more vanilla than ours? No motion, no jet sweeps, 3-4 running plays, etc…. 
 

The playcalling has been horrendous and there definitely needs to be a change with Quinn and/or Rees. You can argue both men were not the top candidates and got selected because they are buddies with the coach. 

11 hours ago, ndomer4 said:

I get it’s a tough environment and all but FSU is HORRIBLE. Yes, on 6 completions it is easy to see he has loads more potential. At this point there isn’t one thing Coan does better than a slightly stronger arm… and I’m not sure if that’s even the case. Pyne has plenty of zip and looks to be more accurate. 
 

I get the shiny new toy argument but we know what Coan is and even with last years o line, he’s not getting us to a playoff. Again I ask, what’s the goal this year? If it’s to win ten games then stay with Coan, but if it’s to potentially win a title we need to go with Pyne. 

Incredibly unlikely we're winning a natty with either... 

And sorry, 6 just isn't enough for me. I'm happy to see more though.

13 hours ago, OKelleyIrish said:

Incredibly unlikely we're winning a natty with either... 

And sorry, 6 just isn't enough for me. I'm happy to see more though.

But with one we know we aren’t and with the other there is some optimism at least. I think people forget how highly Pyne was rated due to his size. 
 

I get the sample size is small but it was enough to want to see more. I understand your view is probably based on the O line but they aren’t as bad as Coan has made them seem in Pass pro. Coan has zero pocket awareness or mobility… with Pyne I think this team can make up for the inability to run block with throwing it all over the yard. 
 

 

 

17 hours ago, ndomer4 said:

This hasn’t been mentioned much but have you seen an offence that looks more vanilla than ours? No motion, no jet sweeps, 3-4 running plays, etc…. 
 

The playcalling has been horrendous and there definitely needs to be a change with Quinn and/or Rees. You can argue both men were not the top candidates and got selected because they are buddies with the coach. 

I thought that they were hired as the result of exhaustive national searches...

I'm putting this here this week.

 

I want to Direct to the point in a video. Where Pyne is about to go in the drive after the fumble. He tells his offense and you can here it, "Look at Jack Coan. Put this in for Jack Coan" Then after the drive he goes and finds Coan"

 

I know the temptation is Pyne v. Coan. But it seems like all 3 want to win for ND and each other.

I'm looking at it as      Coan & Pyne& Buchner. Lot of unselfishness in that locker room

I’m not ready to crown Pyne, but he was much more relaxed and comfortable in the pocket than Coan. Perhaps all the hits he’s taken has affected Coan, but he did not look comfortable or utilize the pocket very well against Wisconsin.  On top of that, Coan underthrew Lenzy twice while his accuracy was inconsistent. He seems to be getting worse, which may be due to being hit too much. I hope he’s full go this week, but his regression is concerning. 

How has nobody called this the “Pyne/Coan Debate”?  I mean it’s right there, waiting to be noticed…

26 minutes ago, TexasDomer said:

How has nobody called this the “Pyne/Coan Debate”?  I mean it’s right there, waiting to be noticed…

Yep! (not claiming to be Ty, just the first time I saw it). Also, if you dont listen to the Solid Verbal, you should

Edited September 29, 20213 yr by Synoptico

On 9/26/2021 at 1:59 PM, ndomer4 said:

This hasn’t been mentioned much but have you seen an offence that looks more vanilla than ours? No motion, no jet sweeps, 3-4 running plays, etc…. 
 

The playcalling has been horrendous and there definitely needs to be a change with Quinn and/or Rees. You can argue both men were not the top candidates and got selected because they are buddies with the coach. 

Agree. I have said it before.Tommy is over his skis. There is nothing to make the defense move their eyes in the offensive scheme. In fact it’s offensive that we have a friggin rookie OC!

12 hours ago, VCDomer said:

Agree. I have said it before.Tommy is over his skis. There is nothing to make the defense move their eyes in the offensive scheme. In fact it’s offensive that we have a friggin rookie OC!

Tommy must have been the best OC available given the exhaustive national search which Kelly conducted. 

I'm sure that Tommy has been keeping part of the playbook under wraps, saving it for 'big games'. At 4-0, hard to complain too much. Hopefully its 5-0 on Saturday.

On 9/26/2021 at 7:43 AM, Rocketsan said:

Not necessarily….but I’m definitely not ready to anoint a new king based on what I saw yesterday. I didn’t see enough. It’s like when people freaked out about Diaco or Tenuta or VanGorder after one killer defensive performance and then crap all over them when the sample size increases… 
 

I wasn’t a fan of bringing in Coan, I would have preferred to have some growing pains with one of our young QBs this year. At the end of the day, I’m glad they did because our o-line has been horrendous and every QB on our roster is going to struggle.

 

I saw Coan do some good things in a very tough environment week one. That resonates well with me better than the struggles of recent weeks. Heck, he hasn’t had time to throw the ball… how many sacks yesterday on him alone? Five? Six? 

I see what you're saying. Seems like qb play is just gonna be streaky all year and we need to ride the hot hand/make adjustments when someone is struggling. I just hope we make changes when we need to and not when it's too late. 

This season is going to be bananas. 

I think we should just start Pyne. Cincinnati is just licking their chops in hopes that we start Coan. Pyne would present problems they haven't faced in th we in first 4 games. Forget the nice guy "Jack Coan is our starting quarterback." stuff. If we start him it could turn into a slogfest of 3 and outs and missed scoring opportunities and put pressure on t he defense. No disrespect to Jack but let him start the easy games. We need to do what we have to to win this game. Use a  prototype Notre Dame quarterback like Pyne and we should get the win.

We are not winning this game with Coan....you need a mobile qb to win a game like this. Unfortunately I don't see us winning starting Jack Coan. 

If Coan is 80 percent you have to at least start him. You need Cincy to have to be aware of the deep threat. But regardless who starts, we are going to see a little of everyone today I think.