Whether you take him seriously or not, he said this today. He talks about Kelly at 37:18

https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-herd-with-colin-cowherd/episode/09-06-2021-hour-2-colin-right-colin-wrong-warren-moon-brian-kelly-86598756

I dont think he is the #2 coach in the country, but I think he is top10.

17 minutes ago, NDhoosier said:

I dont think he is the #2 coach in the country, but I think he is top10.

Agree. I mean. He hasn’t won a Natty yet. I don’t even need to listen to his drivel. Saban and Sweeney have to be top 2. Which one is Kelly dethroning?

BK is easily top 10, maybe top 5.

He's the CEO type of HC, and plays that role very well. His record is very impressive given our admissions standards.

IMO, he's the best we can hope for given our culture. That is unless we hit the jackpot on a young up and comer and all the planets align.... 

I use to want to see him go to a big time public school to work out my hypothesis or an NFL team.

Now I'm happy if he stays at Notre Dame and we'll never find out.

My inclination is that Kirby Smart, Lincoln Riley, Jimbo Fisher or whoever you think is better than him would not have the same success in South Bend as Brian Kelly has had. IMO these coaches are going to make their hay on the backs of the 5* who flock to southern power houses moreso than even Ohio State.

This does not mean, in it's entirety, that Brian Kelly is better than the aforementioned coaches if they couldn't succeed in SB, but you'd need some type of control for this experiment whether that be BK going to the NFL or coaching for another big time college program that offers scholarships to any D1 eligible athlete. I sincerely don't think the latter is going to happen.

Definitely a great debate, but you'd have to ask yourself if you'd trade Brian Kelly for any of these guys right now and why you think they'd succeed moreso than Brian Kelly.

There is so much parody among the not Nick Saban group you can probably group Dabo, Jimbo, Chip Kelly, Kirby Smart, Lincoln Riley in there with Brian Kelly as coaches who've gotten their programs to the cusp of a championship or won it in the last 10 years consistently and you could really make a case for all of them. Brian Kelly has done it with far less talent at the QB position, which he has no one but himself to blame for that.

Edited September 8, 20213 yr by JTennant

2 hours ago, JTennant said:

I use to want to see him go to a big time public school to work out my hypothesis or an NFL team.

Now I'm happy if he stays at Notre Dame and we'll never find out.

My inclination is that Kirby Smart, Lincoln Riley, Jimbo Fisher or whoever you think is better than him would not have the same success in South Bend as Brian Kelly has had. IMO these coaches are going to make their hay on the backs of the 5* who flock to southern power houses moreso than even Ohio State.

This does not mean, in it's entirety, that Brian Kelly is better than the aforementioned coaches if they couldn't succeed in SB, but you'd need some type of control for this experiment whether that be BK going to the NFL or coaching for another big time college program that offers scholarships to any D1 eligible athlete. I sincerely don't think the latter is going to happen.

Definitely a great debate, but you'd have to ask yourself if you'd trade Brian Kelly for any of these guys right now and why you think they'd succeed moreso than Brian Kelly.

There is so much parody among the not Nick Saban group you can probably group Dabo, Jimbo, Chip Kelly, Kirby Smart, Lincoln Riley in there with Brian Kelly as coaches who've gotten their programs to the cusp of a championship or won it in the last 10 years consistently and you could really make a case for all of them. Brian Kelly has done it with far less talent at the QB position, which he has no one but himself to blame for that.

I would say there is Saban clearly at #1, Dabo clearly at #2, then it drops off a bit and you have several guys you could still say are great coaches. 

Saban is a genius in a so many ways, but he gets the best of everything. Coaches, players, facilities, boosters, bagmen, etc.. Dabo has a lot of that too, and Vanables being happy/content to stay is a huge plus for Dabo. He's done a lot with his talent, although it was less than Bama's talent especially in the early going. 

I think overall, ND requires a certain kind of coach. Saban and Dabo have zero desire to be handcuffed like Kelly with admission and other standards. Like I said above, I think BK is likely the best fit we can hope for. We just need to keep hitting on coordinators, and land the best talent we can. While I know Freeman is taking a kick in the jewels over last game, he was the most in-demand DC last year, and he's killed it recruiting on the D side. 

ND just needs some planets to align. Need to hit on an elite QB and skill players on the O side, and have a top 10 D..... 

 Yes BK has brought ND back to being respectable but the fact remains that when the spotlight is on him he fails miserably. He can't get his team prepared for the big game.

23 minutes ago, OKelleyIrish said:

I would say there is Saban clearly at #1, Dabo clearly at #2, then it drops off a bit and you have several guys you could still say are great coaches. 

Saban is a genius in a so many ways, but he gets the best of everything. Coaches, players, facilities, boosters, bagmen, etc.. Dabo has a lot of that too, and Vanables being happy/content to stay is a huge plus for Dabo. He's done a lot with his talent, although it was less than Bama's talent especially in the early going. 

I think overall, ND requires a certain kind of coach. Saban and Dabo have zero desire to be handcuffed like Kelly with admission and other standards. Like I said above, I think BK is likely the best fit we can hope for. We just need to keep hitting on coordinators, and land the best talent we can. While I know Freeman is taking a kick in the jewels over last game, he was the most in-demand DC last year, and he's killed it recruiting on the D side. 

ND just needs some planets to align. Need to hit on an elite QB and skill players on the O side, and have a top 10 D..... 

Ok so resume alone, I'll give you Dabo clearly deserves #2.

However, Dabo didn't really get it popping until they started getting 5* defensive lineman and Heisman worthy QBs - Deshaun Watson & Sunshine.

I think it goes without saying that those two QBs in tandem with a dominant DL will make any "good" coach a NC caliber coach.

Do you think that if BK had a program like Clemson he wouldn't have a NC by now? I think he would, therefore I would put him on Dabo's level (resume aside). I'm not a fan of the standalone resume argument because by that logic you could say Doug Williams was a better QB than Dan Marino.

I think if roles were reversed, Dabo would have already been let go from UND and Brian Kelly would have a football factory, therefore I think Brian Kelly is as good if not a better coach than Dabo.

My opinion and 2 cents, hah.

13 minutes ago, JTennant said:

Ok so resume alone, I'll give you Dabo clearly deserves #2.

However, Dabo didn't really get it popping until they started getting 5* defensive lineman and Heisman worthy QBs - Deshaun Watson & Sunshine.

I think it goes without saying that those two QBs in tandem with a dominant DL will make any "good" coach a NC caliber coach.

Do you think that if BK had a program like Clemson he wouldn't have a NC by now? I think he would, therefore I would put him on Dabo's level (resume aside). I'm not a fan of the standalone resume argument because by that logic you could say Doug Williams was a better QB than Dan Marino.

I think if roles were reversed, Dabo would have already been let go from UND and Brian Kelly would have a football factory, therefore I think Brian Kelly is as good if not a better coach than Dabo.

My opinion and 2 cents, hah.

IDK. When a lot of people think about BK, they think about his Os at Cinci. They don't realize BK himself played D, and his coaching rise was on the D side prior to being a HC. I think he's a good "blend" type HC, who is best as the CEO. I don't think he's an elite O or D mind, and I don't think he's an elite recruiter. I thinks he's a great combo of all things who has learned to be the CEO type.

Dabo grew up Bama.... lol. Saying he didn't start hitting until he had 5 stars really isn't fair. He won the Atlantic side of the ACC in his second year, and was only a few points shy of winning the ACC. He had never been a HC before. By year 4 he hit the 10 win mark, and has won 10 or more games every year since. He's got a great O mind, and he's a great recruiter. He's got probably the best DC in the nation on the other side of the ball who is happy not being a HC... 

My 2 cents ?

Does the second best head coach in the country hire the following string of OC's?

It is likely that Brian Kelly might have won 11 more games in his career hiring better coordinators (both OCs and DCs) including the two that he had to fire mid-season.

Charley Molnar (Current QB coach at Idaho)

Chuck Martin (Current HC at Miami OH but had never coached offense before)

Mike Denbrock (Current OC at Cincinnati)

Mike Sanford, Jr. (Current OC at Minnesota)

Chip Long (Current OC at Tulane)

Tommy Rees (First time OC at ND)

 

 

 

14 hours ago, OKelleyIrish said:

IDK. When a lot of people think about BK, they think about his Os at Cinci. They don't realize BK himself played D, and his coaching rise was on the D side prior to being a HC. I think he's a good "blend" type HC, who is best as the CEO. I don't think he's an elite O or D mind, and I don't think he's an elite recruiter. I thinks he's a great combo of all things who has learned to be the CEO type.

Dabo grew up Bama.... lol. Saying he didn't start hitting until he had 5 stars really isn't fair. He won the Atlantic side of the ACC in his second year, and was only a few points shy of winning the ACC. He had never been a HC before. By year 4 he hit the 10 win mark, and has won 10 or more games every year since. He's got a great O mind, and he's a great recruiter. He's got probably the best DC in the nation on the other side of the ball who is happy not being a HC... 

My 2 cents ?

To add to that, Clemson was Clemsoning before he got there. They were not some dominant program before he got there. The fact that he and his players said Clemsoning stopped when they beat ND the first time they played in awhile demonstrates who’s the better coach right there. 
If BK wanted to be number 2 he shouldn’t of lost to Clemson that game. 

2 hours ago, coltssb said:

To add to that, Clemson was Clemsoning before he got there. They were not some dominant program before he got there. The fact that he and his players said Clemsoning stopped when they beat ND the first time they played in awhile demonstrates who’s the better coach right there. 
If BK wanted to be number 2 he shouldn’t of lost to Clemson that game. 

Given that Dabo got the monkey off of Clemson's back and given BK's record of losing in big games (especially in the post-season), instead of "Clemsoning", should the new term now be "ND'ing", "Irishing", or "Kellying"? 

8 hours ago, coltssb said:

To add to that, Clemson was Clemsoning before he got there. They were not some dominant program before he got there. The fact that he and his players said Clemsoning stopped when they beat ND the first time they played in awhile demonstrates who’s the better coach right there. 
If BK wanted to be number 2 he shouldn’t of lost to Clemson that game. 

Yup. Anyone that knows Clemson's history, and Dabo's, knows he's had an impressive climb. I live in the SE now, and have a lot of Clemson fans as friends. I was at the hurricane game between ND and Clemson. We lost, but still was one of the best games I've ever been too. Definitely the wettest one lol... 

21 hours ago, jbrown_9999 said:

Does the second best head coach in the country hire the following string of OC's?

It is likely that Brian Kelly might have won 11 more games in his career hiring better coordinators (both OCs and DCs) including the two that he had to fire mid-season.

Charley Molnar (Current QB coach at Idaho)

Chuck Martin (Current HC at Miami OH but had never coached offense before)

Mike Denbrock (Current OC at Cincinnati)

Mike Sanford, Jr. (Current OC at Minnesota)

Chip Long (Current OC at Tulane)

Tommy Rees (First time OC at ND)

 

 

 

BK, in the early days, hired way too many of his previous assistants, but all coaches do. Molnar was someone BK probably shouldn't have kept around.

Martin had a very good run at GVS, and was highly thought of for a time. 5 straight conference titles can't be ignored.

Denbrock has had varied success, but I don't see him as an awful hire at all. Cinci sure has done well lately.

Sanford had a lot of success and was seen an in-demand up and comer, so no shame on that one either.

I was never really a fan of Long. 

Rees is still early stages. Book under him played above his ceiling IMO. It's early for Coan, but Coan certainly looked better in game 1 than he did at Wiscy. If ND's O continues to look good the next couple years, Rees will likely get a HC job opportunity at mid major or lower P5. And that's impressive for his age.