As Okwara had Costello in his hands on that 3rd Down and 8 post route for A TD, or Costello dusted himself off after another clutch throw. I could not help but think how close the defense is to that next level.

 

You say they gave up points late? I say the turnover only gave them 30 yards and less yards to defend.

 

Or as Finke tripped over a punter, on the way to an even bigger punt return.

 

I still can't Ignore this number.

 

21.8 that's the average number of points our defense allowed a game.

 

Or this. Even 35.3 on offense was 1.3 better than the fuller year of 2015

 

This is with the QB with all the criticism

 

The RB's and OL that gave us so much, yet what sticks out is shortcomings.

 

The first positive turnover margin since 2012.

 

Guys, you can read signs pointing to disaster if you want, not me, I'm going to let it play out and read the signs that we don't want to see right now because they got us so close and fell short.

 

Just toggle these stats to our other years guys:

 

If you choose to look at it there are signs. You can say I'm just sugar coating a dead end if you wish but I've always welcomed others points of view.

 

http://www.cfbstats.com/2017/team/513/index.html

Agreed. D did very well this year despite its weaknesses.

 

 

Guys, you can read signs pointing to disaster if you want, not me, I'm going to let it play out and read the signs that we don't want to see right now because they got us so close and fell short.

 

I don't think most people see disaster. They see more of the same.

 

Let me give you one example: After the Finke punt return, we had two procedure penalties.

 

One step forward, one step back....

 

That is what it is to be an ND fan in the Kelly era for me.

 

You think that's gonna change with more time as Brian Kelly as Head Coach? Fine. But I hope you can understand why lots of people disagree.

8 years of positive signs and next year will be better. I hope you're right faith but I cant buy in anymore. I'll hold out hope but I have zero confidence that next year will be any different then the first 8.

Yeah but Brian Kelly is still the coach. We might have capitalized on the punt return if he didn't insist on trotting out a hobbled Adams. We had a line with two first round draft picks and mostly seniors but couldn't get a push against top defenses.

 

We've now heard coaches, year after year comment on how predictable we are on offence. None of this stubbornness and poor game planning is not going to change, and if Bw starts we still don't have a quarterback.

I don't think most people see disaster. They see more of the same.

 

Let me give you one example: After the Finke punt return, we had two procedure penalties.

 

One step forward, one step back....

 

That is what it is to be an ND fan in the Kelly era for me.

 

You think that's gonna change with more time as Brian Kelly as Head Coach? Fine. But I hope you can understand why lots of people disagree.

 

I'm not sure what I think really. I've never been a huge Kelly guy. But I am an Elko guy.

 

8 years of positive signs and next year will be better. I hope you're right faith but I cant buy in anymore. I'll hold out hope but I have zero confidence that next year will be any different then the first 8.

 

I see signs both ways so I'm not sure they make me right or wrong. Just I know they won't changes coaches right now.

As Okwara had Costello in his hands on that 3rd Down and 8 post route for A TD, or Costello dusted himself off after another clutch throw. I could not help but think how close the defense is to that next level.

 

You say they gave up points late? I say the turnover only gave them 30 yards and less yards to defend.

 

Or as Finke tripped over a punter, on the way to an even bigger punt return.

 

I still can't Ignore this number.

 

21.8 that's the average number of points our defense allowed a game.

 

Or this. Even 35.3 on offense was 1.3 better than the fuller year of 2015

 

This is with the QB with all the criticism

 

The RB's and OL that gave us so much, yet what sticks out is shortcomings.

 

The first positive turnover margin since 2012.

 

Guys, you can read signs pointing to disaster if you want, not me, I'm going to let it play out and read the signs that we don't want to see right now because they got us so close and fell short.

 

Just toggle these stats to our other years guys:

 

If you choose to look at it there are signs. You can say I'm just sugar coating a dead end if you wish but I've always welcomed others points of view.

 

http://www.cfbstats.com/2017/team/513/index.html

 

Great post, Faith! With you 100 percent on this. You're 360 degrees from that negative nebob of negativism, Handsome Jack,l on this board.

Faith will just ban anyone who disagrees with him.

 

Okwara reminds me of some kid that played at florida or miami years ago. His nickname was the freak.

 

I'm conflicted with finke being a punt returner. On one hand he can catch but don't realistically have the speed to take it to the house. So we're really just fair catching.

 

And faith knows I'm justing yanking his chain.

 

Great mod and friend.

Signs? Here's one.

 

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_gKQKwLZ8XUs/TAeuSKSj-MI/AAAAAAAAC1s/wqzBAGG99Qc/s800/Funny-Signs-Cow-35.jpg

Alright guys lets keep this on track,

 

Best to you all!

 

Go Irish!

8 years of positive signs and next year will be better. I hope you're right faith but I cant buy in anymore. I'll hold out hope but I have zero confidence that next year will be any different then the first 8.

 

How anyone can have any confidence in Kelly at this point in his tenure at Notre Dame is off his rocker.

As Okwara had Costello in his hands on that 3rd Down and 8 post route for A TD, or Costello dusted himself off after another clutch throw. I could not help but think how close the defense is to that next level.

 

You say they gave up points late? I say the turnover only gave them 30 yards and less yards to defend.

 

Or as Finke tripped over a punter, on the way to an even bigger punt return.

 

I still can't Ignore this number.

 

21.8 that's the average number of points our defense allowed a game.

 

Or this. Even 35.3 on offense was 1.3 better than the fuller year of 2015

 

This is with the QB with all the criticism

 

The RB's and OL that gave us so much, yet what sticks out is shortcomings.

 

The first positive turnover margin since 2012.

 

Guys, you can read signs pointing to disaster if you want, not me, I'm going to let it play out and read the signs that we don't want to see right now because they got us so close and fell short.

 

Just toggle these stats to our other years guys:

 

If you choose to look at it there are signs. You can say I'm just sugar coating a dead end if you wish but I've always welcomed others points of view.

 

http://www.cfbstats.com/2017/team/513/index.html

 

Since you hijacked my hijack I will add a few thoughts:

 

1. You can hardly fault the defense against Miami or Stanford, you cannot commit turnovers at that cut and expect to win. In addition to the short field, when your defense generates stops and turnovers you have to score points, otherwise it really demoralizes the defense.

 

2. Can't follow up one good thing with two bad things. Procedure penalties are minor for sure, but it just takes away the momentum fast.

 

3. If you want to think about how painfully close things were this year just think about one single play, Wimbush's sack fumble to end the Georgia game. We were driving, had a rhythm going, and all was looking good. McGlinchey whiffs on his block, game over.

 

If we walk away from the Georgia game with a W instead of an L who knows how the landscape of the season changes? If football really is more mental than physical you are looking at a huge shift.

Since you hijacked my hijack I will add a few thoughts:

 

1. You can hardly fault the defense against Miami or Stanford, you cannot commit turnovers at that cut and expect to win. In addition to the short field, when your defense generates stops and turnovers you have to score points, otherwise it really demoralizes the defense.

 

2. Can't follow up one good thing with two bad things. Procedure penalties are minor for sure, but it just takes away the momentum fast.

 

3. If you want to think about how painfully close things were this year just think about one single play, Wimbush's sack fumble to end the Georgia game. We were driving, had a rhythm going, and all was looking good. McGlinchey whiffs on his block, game over.

 

If we walk away from the Georgia game with a W instead of an L who knows how the landscape of the season changes? If football really is more mental than physical you are looking at a huge shift.

 

Good points. Those are all keys to avoid losing. Reminds me of Kelly's first presser. "The keys to start winning are to stop losing" He meant turnovers and penalties. Has not really come true but the issue is he's still a safe guy for the powers that be. As long as that is true which it is, I will make the best of it and hope the kids are so good we win anyway.

Good points. Those are all keys to avoid losing. Reminds me of Kelly's first presser. "The keys to start winning are to stop losing" He meant turnovers and penalties. Has not really come true but the issue is he's still a safe guy for the powers that be. As long as that is true which it is, I will make the best of it and hope the kids are so good we win anyway.

 

If the only way things can get better is for BK to leave then things have to get worse before they get better, which stinks. That said, if we are all honest and look at what we expected out of the season vs. what we got every single person should be happy. With a small number of exceptions no one expected more than eight wins.

 

So I am looking at my own situation and thinking, why am I pissed? I hoped for eight wins. I got nine. We put a fantastic beatdown on SC. The team exceeded my expectations. The answer is pretty simple, I got spoiled and expected more than I originally asked, so to speak. I saw a team that looked like it was a top 4 team that fell apart at the end. But the truth is they overachieved, not the other way around. So I am trying to content myself with that.

 

Going forward to be successful I feel like ND needs to figure out the QB situation better. Could be that hiring Rees and handing over the offense to Long will be enough. Could be that Wimbush is too much a project for Rees, or that their styles are so different that it is just incompatible. I personally feel like we are going to have to part ways with Hiestand before we can get to the next level. I realize he has "produced" some NFL caliber linemen, but I think that is more about the recruiting and the talent than his work. His line seldom performs in high pressure situations.

 

So I am off the "Fire BK" bandwagon for now, it isn't going to make things better and after a nine win regular season I probably shouldn't be crying about needing a change. Get a QB who is TAUGHT HOW TO lead the team and things will turn around. When things start to go south, turnover, short field, quick score, it is on the field leadership that stops the slide and reins things in. THAT is what we need.

 

Nothing against Wimbush, he is in his first year and I think he can be great. He needs to be nurtured and taught still. Send him to that QB guru (Washington?) over the summer to work on his mechanics and accuracy, keep working on his leadership and confidence, and he will be fine. Kid is an amazing athlete.

Good points. Those are all keys to avoid losing. Reminds me of Kelly's first presser. "The keys to start winning are to stop losing" He meant turnovers and penalties. Has not really come true but the issue is he's still a safe guy for the powers that be. As long as that is true which it is, I will make the best of it and hope the kids are so good we win anyway.

 

Our players aren't so good that they can win despite Kelly. At least not at a BCS game participant level.

 

I think Kelly is at ND because ND made another contractual blunder with him and they don't want to look like they are reckless with money in something so inconsequential to them as football.

Our players aren't so good that they can win despite Kelly. At least not at a BCS game participant level.

 

I think Kelly is at ND because ND made another contractual blunder with him and they don't want to look like they are reckless with money in something so inconsequential to them as football.

 

I disagree. I think JS gave BK an ultimatum to right the ship or be gone.

 

BK went out and made numerous changes, that immediately paid off for overall team success.

 

This year was a rebound year with a lot of positive signs. There were two negative issues

 

1) Overall SOS....which is outside of BK's control

2) BW's poor passing which is completely controllable

 

Next year strength of schedule will be similar so, what can BK improve on 2017?

 

The only way is to balance out the offense with better passing and staying healthy (requires some luck)

I disagree. I think JS gave BK an ultimatum to right the ship or be gone.

 

BK went out and made numerous changes, that immediately paid off for overall team success.

 

This year was a rebound year with a lot of positive signs. There were two negative issues

 

1) Overall SOS....which is outside of BK's control

2) BW's poor passing which is completely controllable

 

Next year strength of schedule will be similar so, what can BK improve on 2017?

 

The only way is to balance out the offense with better passing and staying healthy (requires some luck)

 

I don't consider 2017 a rebound year. He didn't work in 2016. So, that was the anomoly. He reverted back to his ceiling of three losses in 2017. Anybody believing this is a BCS program is deluding themselves.

Our players aren't so good that they can win despite Kelly. At least not at a BCS game participant level.

 

I think Kelly is at ND because ND made another contractual blunder with him and they don't want to look like they are reckless with money in something so inconsequential to them as football.

 

Whatever the reason. I will always hope the kids succeed. If that means more Kelly than Kelly it is.

I disagree. I think JS gave BK an ultimatum to right the ship or be gone.

 

BK went out and made numerous changes, that immediately paid off for overall team success.

 

This year was a rebound year with a lot of positive signs. There were two negative issues

 

1) Overall SOS....which is outside of BK's control

2) BW's poor passing which is completely controllable

 

Next year strength of schedule will be similar so, what can BK improve on 2017?

 

The only way is to balance out the offense with better passing and staying healthy (requires some luck)

 

Fire Hiestand. Recruit better O Lineman. Develop a Quarterback.

Fire Hiestand. Recruit better O Lineman. Develop a Quarterback.

 

Offensive line and Hiestand are not the problem...

 

Notre Dame is one of three finalists (Alabama and Auburn) for the Joe Moore Award for best offensive line in the country.

 

Mike McGlinchey and Quenton Nelson finished the regular season as the No. 1 and No. 3 graded offensive lineman per PFF. Nelson was the highest rated LG and McGlinchey was the highest rated LT. They will be consensus first team All Americans.

 

Quarterback on the other hand is a major concern...

 

Unreal how Wimbush's fundamentals are this bad. I get that he is a first time starter, so the numbers might not be great, but his mechanics shouldn't be this awful. I think he only had 3 games where he threw over 50%. 3!

 

Let Tom Rees go and hire a proven QB coach.

Offensive line and Hiestand are not the problem...

 

Notre Dame is one of three finalists (Alabama and Auburn) for the Joe Moore Award for best offensive line in the country.

 

I see an OL that has been soft as pudding ever since Warriner left. We were embarrassed and dominated by UGA. We were lucky the score wasn't a bigger difference. I think if that wasn't Jeff Frohm State Farms first game, Kirby Smart would have let him open it up some more. 3/4 of one season is not going to change my perception. We had tough time getting it going against Wake early on as well as Navy.. Don't vomit our rushing stats against Wake because our QB had more than half of those at halftime. When you watch for the push and the crease that the backs need, it's simply not there if you want to dominate a team.

 

If we wanna compete for national titles, the talent level on the offensive line has to improve tremendously. Look at the dudes Auburn has. We are not even in the same stadium as Auburn when it comes to O Line talent. We have big dudes that are not very athletic. We need both skillsets.