davislove Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I stole this from elder. The question is simple: Should a coaching change be: A) For the sake of change B) To land a home run hire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELDER06 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I know this will shock people, but Kelly is NOT the worst coach in college football. In fact, ND has hired a lot worse in the past. I'm steadfast in my belief, you don't get rid of Kelly until there's a better option. Last year, there simply wasn't anyone available who was a better trade off. This year, Stoops is already in play and I'm certain Bill O'Brien and Chip Kelly will be looking for new jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LasVegasIrish Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I vote in-between. ND should not keep BK if they feel the team's performance is suffering under his leadership. You figure out the coaching search after that. You don't keep a coach for the sake of simply keeping coach just like you don't make change for the sake of change. On the other hand, when someone new is hired you hope he's the next great coach for your school. Unfortunately, that is not always the case. Plenty of guys are out there that either deserve chances at bigger school (like BK a few years back) or have proven themselves and may choose to accept the challenge of ND. Disclaimer: This is not a post for or against BK, just my thoughts on how coaching hiring/firings should be handled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davislove Posted July 7, 2017 Author Share Posted July 7, 2017 I vote in-between. ND should not keep BK if they feel the team's performance is suffering under his leadership. You figure out the coaching search after that. You don't keep a coach for the sake of simply keeping coach just like you don't make change for the sake of change. On the other hand, when someone new is hired you hope he's the next great coach for your school. Unfortunately, that is not always the case. Plenty of guys are out there that either deserve chances at bigger school (like BK a few years back) or have proven themselves and may choose to accept the challenge of ND. Disclaimer: This is not a post for or against BK, just my thoughts on how coaching hiring/firings should be handled. For me you look to hire a home run. A change for the sake of changing is an interim coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavic Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Don't change coaches for the sake of change but if recruiting falls off then administration must make a change. ND cannot afford to go through Willingham type recruiting years again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goirish83 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Just curious who qualifies as a "home run" hire. Some people may think 1 coach is a home run while others don't. Personally I think meyer and saban are the only true home run hires with stoops, Peterson and harbaugh closely following. If you're saying keep Kelly until you can one of those 5 I would disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incurorish Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Sometimes a program grows stale and is no longer improving. It's at that moment where a coaching change can help reinvigorate a program. Whether that person turns out to be a "home-run" only time can tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davislove Posted July 7, 2017 Author Share Posted July 7, 2017 Just curious who qualifies as a "home run" hire. Some people may think 1 coach is a home run while others don't. Personally I think meyer and saban are the only true home run hires with stoops, Peterson and harbaugh closely following. If you're saying keep Kelly until you can one of those 5 I would disagree. You're changing the question again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corysold Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) The answer is both. You make the change because you need a change and you hope you hit a home run. Is any hire a guaranteed homerun? Let's say ND hired Nick Saban tomorrow. While he is certainly way better than Kelly, would he win 4 titles at ND in the next 7 years? I don't know. His greatest talent is getting the best team. He recruits better than just about everyone else. At Michigan St and Miami, when he didn't have the best team, he didn't have amazing records. How would he do if he didn't have a 3 deep of NFL defensive lineman to use? Would those Southern 5* kids follow him to ND? Would they even qualify? For examply, his 2001 LSU class, which won the 2003 title, had 5 5* players, three from Louisiana and two from Texas. Why would they come to ND? His first 3 Alabama classes had 6-7 5* players from Alabama. Why would they go to ND? So Saban would be a "home run", but is he the best coach for Notre Dame? I honestly don't know. Maybe a guy like Chris Petersen, who has shown he can win with lesser players, would be a better fit. He could get top 10 classes at ND and coach them to be like top 3 classes. There are no guarantees in coaching. Sure, guys like Saban and Meyer would be great hires, but if you take away their greatest asset, the ability to recruit the very best players, would they still be the games greatest coaches? Could Notre Dame land top 3 classes year in and year out if you have to exclude some of the greatest talents due to academics? Edited July 7, 2017 by corysold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 My initial thought was you make a change when the situation dictates, though you should always be looking to make that home run hire in that case. But the Cubs went strictly for the home run with Joe Maddon and that worked out pretty well for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim2Dokes Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) Agree with Cory, Utah with Meyer was not in the PAC 12 so we really can't look at that as great coaching, but it was solid as solid as Kelly at CIncy for sure. Sabah at MSU did nothing Dantonio has not done. Their greatest assets are recruiting from what we can see. It is tough without being there to know how great they are. Bill Self and John Calipari of football. All great coaches but tough to know how great they would be at ND As far as future coach, let's see how this season pans out. I would pass on Stoops though. Take a look at PJ if he wins 9 games at Minnesota. Edited July 8, 2017 by Jim2Dokes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELDER06 Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 Agree with Cory, Utah with Meyer was not in the PAC 12 so we really can't look at that as great coaching, but it was solid as solid as Kelly at CIncy for sure. Sabah at MSU did nothing Dantonio has not done. Their greatest assets are recruiting from what we can see. It is tough without being there to know how great they are. Bill Self and John Calipari of football. All great coaches but tough to know how great they would be at ND As far as future coach, let's see how this season pans out. I would pass on Stoops though. Take a look at PJ if he wins 9 games at Minnesota. I want to preface, I'd still prefer ND win 9-10 games this season and Kelly comeback. However, I don't think that will happen. And if I had my choice it'd be Bill O'Brien with Stoops a close 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCDomer Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 The framing of the question/poll is short of a full understanding of the status of ND football and more a self indulgent and veined attempt at "see me" "I'm beautiful" "I have meaning" OK Smalley. We see you. LMAO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goirish83 Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 You're changing the question again. Actually just looking for clarity because defining what a home run hire is would dictate a lot of answers. You provided a vague poll question, just trying to help you out pal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LasVegasIrish Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 My initial thought was you make a change when the situation dictates, though you should always be looking to make that home run hire in that case. But the Cubs went strictly for the home run with Joe Maddon and that worked out pretty well for them. Well yes, that was a different scenario. Not everyone can get what they want as easily as they did in that scenario. They were content with Renteria, when Maddon came around they jumped. A lot easier said than done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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