hawaiiirish 62 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Late post cause I DVR'd the game on at 5.30 AM here---so thankful I didn't get up for that.... I have made this point for four years but every time it happens I feel compelled to make it again. Kelly's game day decisions are IMHO--the WORST I have ever seen out of a HC at any level. I was totally perplexed on the 4th and 4 with under 6 minutes left and Coach decides to TRY and bring the score down to a 1 point lead.... Navy had the ball all half--THEY HAD CLEARLY DISPLAYED that they could keep the ball for LOOONG periods.... So WHAT THE THINKING WAS that somehow cutting the lead to one point when your on the 20 and unlikely to get the ball back with much time IF YOU GOT IT BACK AT ALL----was just LOW IQ thinking IMO. Kelly simply makes panic riddled WRONG CHOICES again and again--- Now I thought it was a mistake to give the ball back to MSU earlier in the year on 4th down in the 4th quarter --I suspected we wouldn't get the ball back and sure enough WE DID NOT! But this was worse--it was clear how DIFFICULT it was for the defense to get the ball back quickly---time was running out---and we were down by 4--- GOING FOR THE FG there was in my view MORONIC! HOW MANY TIMES does Kelly have to put the game in the hands of a defense that cannot make big stops rather then roll the dice with your strength.... Even if we go there and fail are odds of winning are ALMOST THE SAME AS GOING FOR THE FG.... Kelly TRULY has the worse LOGIC and INSTINCTS during the game as any coach I have ever seen.... Kelly should take a lesson from GEORGE COSTANZA and start doing the opposite of every instinct he has during the game.... Its kind of stunning that he makes the wrong choice in what to me was such an OBVIOUS situation..... Ask yourself this----IF THE SAME CIRCUMSTANCES WERE REVERSED WHAT WOULD KEN NIUMATOLOMU HAVE DONE ????? We all know the answer to that....yet was a really surprised ? No Watching the game I said "Kelly always does this and we won't ever get the ball back" Sometimes I want to grab Coach by the shirt collar and slap some sense into him.... 3-6 in what is becoming IMHO THE WORST SEASON OF COACHING AT ND SINCE JOE KUARICH over half a century ago ---Ty may still be holding a small edge for that honor for his 03/04 decisions and coaching--- But I expect Kelly to hold the honor exclusively by himself by years end with a couple more stellar efforts... Low point for KELLY IN HIS CAREER Low point for ND under Kelly Tough to swallow even after all the losses---not as painful after losing so much---BUT REALLY SAD aloha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTennant 290 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 I would have erred on the side of going for it on 4-4 with 6 minutes left but if you don't convert and Navy scores, it's over. We could have theoretically let navy score and got the ball back down 8. Toss up IMO and hindsight is 20-20. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishrush 60 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 I have been opposed to letting Kelly go, but there is no other option now. That was a strategic blunder of epic proportions. What game was he watching where he thought we could stop them and get the ball back? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishrb 0 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 At the time, my son was pretty adamant that they should kick the field goal there. Six and a half minutes left with three time outs.....PLUS BK would probably throw the ball three yards behind the line of scrimmage anyways....SO either way, it wouldn't have mattered. It is just time for him to go....No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crouchingjedi 0 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Agreed Hawaii. Kelly played this game not to lose instead of to win. You can't play that way against navy. The other thing regarding coaching: we had NO answer for the pitch man all game. Totally unacceptable when you have two option teams on your schedule back to back and a bye week two weeks before... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndomer4 532 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Are you surprised? We've seen this same crap for seven years now. I knew we weren't getting ball back, heck I think ever ND fan knew it. At this point Army might beat us, and I think that would force the high ups at ND to cut him loose. Who else is exhausted from this season? So much to look forward too and such a huge letdown. Well as we've been saying here for over 20 years now better luck next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishmike 0 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Ken = Balls (Ken went for it on 4th down to end the game if they dont get it then ND goes down and kicks fg for win) BK = no balls (BK doesnt go for it, instead elects to be down by one) The difference in the game..balls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiiirish 62 Posted November 5, 2016 Author Share Posted November 5, 2016 It seems to me that Kelly is so concerned about making a strategic mistake that he thinks himself into that same strategic mistake time and time again.... When you don't really have confidence in your own choices--confidence that comes from trial and error leading to SUCCESSFUL thinking---Kelly lost that here if he ever had it---that leads to CASCADING ERRORS. Its very generous to call that FG a 50/50 call... Even if we went and failed--AND WE HAD CONVERTED ON BOTH OUT $TH DOWN GOES.....but even if we failed ---Navy's ball and we still NEED a stop to try a winning play.... We gave up the chance at a winning play simply to open up the OPTION of winning With a FG rather then a TD.... TINY BENIFIT to give up a TRULY GOOD SHOT at a 4th down conversion and a win ... Not even a close call for a team with a proven weak defense. aloha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTennant 290 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 I took it as his way to protect the defense knowing we would probably give up a score either way.. I'm not defending his reason and I would have gone for it, but on the long list of egregious coaching decisions, this isn't in his top 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imroc 4 Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Are you surprised? We've seen this same crap for seven years now. I knew we weren't getting ball back, heck I think ever ND fan knew it. At this point Army might beat us, and I think that would force the high ups at ND to cut him loose. Who else is exhausted from this season? So much to look forward too and such a huge letdown. Well as we've been saying here for over 20 years now better luck next year. This here. Kelly could NOT win the "big games" as everybody states, however, the fact that he struggled year to year against the Navy is far too overlooked only a week after playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alteredboy 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 I was hoping that Kelly would LET them score so he could at least give the offense a chance to score and try for 2. I was actually thinking that MAYBE that was his plan. Then he blew his time outs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imroc 4 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 I was hoping that Kelly would LET them score so he could at least give the offense a chance to score and try for 2. I was actually thinking that MAYBE that was his plan. Then he blew his time outs. Unfortunately, his goggles won't let him see in the red zone, so a 2pt conv is way outta his vision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davislove 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 It seems to me that Kelly is so concerned about making a strategic mistake that he thinks himself into that same strategic mistake time and time again.... Spot on Hawaii. We play Navy every year, we have a coach dedicated stopping the option. By now no team in the country should be better then us vs the triple option. It doesn't make sense. Also, I'm so sick of kelly saying how proud he is of his team. Comments like that is why people view him as a phony. I was afraid of losing kelly because we couldn't get anyone better. Now i wonder can anyone be worse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDMJ1984 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 D minus analysis as usual from the resident Monday morning (afternoon) quarterback. Though not surprising from a guy who blabbed last week that U of Hawaii football, which lost 55-0 today to San Diego St., was more "focused, better schemed, fundamentally solid and impassioned" than Notre Dame. Kicking the field goal was the right choice, and here's why: First, if the presumption is that we had no chance of stopping them to get the ball back, what difference would scoring the TD have made? By that logic, we make it 31-28, Navy burns the clock, but scores a TD at the end to make it 35-31. We still lose. ND needed a stop no matter what. Second, look back at Kaizer's 3 previous throws: missed Hunter open in the end zone, overthrew Stepherson by 5 feet, then threw way behind Steph on a crossing route (Steph bailed him out with a great catch). What leads you to believe a notoriously streaky player would suddenly collect himself and throw a great pass on 4th down? Third, let's assume we don't get the TD or conversion, but then we make the stop we would have needed to win anyway. Now we need a TD, instead of a FG. As you pointed out, Navy is exceptional at bleeding clock. With an uncertain amount of time left, I'd much rather be down 1 than 4. Kicking was the right decision. It didn't work out, but that doesn't mean it was "obviously wrong" based on the circumstances at the time, and certainly wasn't "MORONIC". This doesn't excuse poor decisions in previous games, a poor defensive game plan in my opinion, or recruiting failures that necessitate playing an all freshmen secondary, but in a vacuum, not a decision "worthy" of another of your perpetual, incoherent rants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemlover 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 Kicking was the wrong choice for one very simple reason. We hadn't stopped them all day. That's the only stat one needs to consider when deciding whether a field goal would be enough in that situation. Okay, technically we did stop them once. And then we had 12 men on the field in punt receive formation!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Talk about horrible coaching. That is 100% about preparation. Even if this was the first game of the season, that would be unacceptable. That it occurred this late in the season is humiliating. Especially when Brian Kelly, who has called a timeout on Notre Dame's first possession of the game in the past, had all of his timeouts available. Call a timeout if needbe. Yes, fans like me would be yelling at the TV again, wondering why Notre Dame needed to call a TO when its 4th and 6, not 4th and 1 and Navy is about to punt the ball to us. But at least it would have saved him the embarrassment of that penalty. Oh, and if Navy hadn't scored there, that would have made the field goal a good choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish9 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 I said to my son when ND kicked that we will not get the ball back. I knew we had no chance of stopping them and the clock would run out. Why would Kelly believe our defense could stop them. But lets be real here. Our offense should have put up 50. Kizers stats may be ok but he was awful. Throwing behind, over and low all day to wide open receivers. The defense did enough to win. Holding Navy to 28 is and should have been good enough to win that game by 21. Our offense sucks too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ny 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 I think what everybody is forgetting is that the Def did stop them, but a "special teams" mistake made a 4th and 6 to a fourth and 1. This is a flawed team of epic proportions. The thing is bk settled for 10-3. Not seeing that bvg was horrible. Having given him total control with no input while they struggled is/was mind boggling. If he makes it through this season everything must be reevaluated!!!!! Get a proven special teams coach, proven def cod, and just like you simplifed the def, simplify the off. Establish a run and stop run mentality. Get after the qb. If i was JS i would be on the phone with feelers to see who is interested. If a big name bites, you let bk go. Because if bk was good with 10-3 then he is the wrong person gor this program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davislove 0 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 Ship be sinking. I think we all know how this story ends. It's just a matter of do you want the new coach to have something to work with, our give BK another year to destroy everything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly Gruene 26 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 Ship be sinking. I think we all know how this story ends. It's just a matter of do you want the new coach to have something to work with, our give BK another year to destroy everything? Exactly. Staring a 3-9 or 4-8 season in the face, can the Powers-that-Be realistically think that this same head coach can take these same players (minus Kizer going to the NFL and Zaire going to some other school) to a 10+ win season one year from now, even with a new DC? I've said it before, but maybe it's more appropriate this week: that splashing sound you'll be hearing between now and the end of the month will be some of the recruits jumping ship. Maybe that would actually force the Powers' hands, kind of like watching how Ty decimated the recruiting ranks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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