Araparseghianfan Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) The main, if not the only, defense of BK supporters is 2012. What they fail to note is that Kelly every bit as bad as his 3 predecessors except for 2012. The NC game has been around since January 1999( 1998 season.) I have looked at the coaches who have appeared in the NC game and determined that Brian Kelly is the worst coach to ever go to the NC game. For this analysis I am only considering the coach's tenure at the school where they made the NC game. That takes out of consideration BK's tenure at Cincy, Chizik's 5-19 at ISU, etc. I am going to compare Kelly to coaches in the NC game who later got fired. I'm not even going to bother comparing him to Saban, Meyer, Caroll etc. There are 6 NC game coaches who later got fired- Phillip Fulmer, Larry Coker, Jim Tressel, Frank Solich, Mack Brown, Gene Chizik and Les Miles. I am not including Tressel in this analysis since his firing had nothing to do with on field play. I also will include in my analysis Mark Helfrich and Gus Malzahn, both of whom are currently on the hot seat 1. Kelly vs Larry Coker and Frank Solich As much as Coker and Solich may have been winning based on what their predecessors did they never[ tanked like Kelly is doing this year. Even in their worst seasons they both went 7-6 and managed trips to the Toilet Bowl. Furthermore they both went 9-3 or better is every season except the one where they bottomed out. If you separate Coker, Solich and Kelly by how they did with their predecessors players (first 3 years) vs how they did with their own players it looks like this. Coker 35-3 (.921) with predecessor's players, 25-12 (.676) without Solich 32-7 (.821) with predessor's players, 27-12 (.692) without Kelly 28-11 (.718) with predecessor's players, 29-17 (.630) without 2. Kelly vs Mack Brown and Phil Fulmer. Both had pretty big 4 year ruts to end their career. Brown was 30-21 his last 4 years while Phil Fulmer was 29-21. However, if ND goes 3-9 this year, Kelly's record over the last 4 years will be 30-21. What's more important is that Fulmer and Brown both had great success for more than a decade before their 4 year ruts. Brown had a career .826 win percentage from 1998-2009 before his collapse from 2009-2013 dropped his career win % to .767. Fulmer had a .793 win % from 1992-2004 before his collapse dropped his win % to .743. 3. Brian Kelly vs Les Miles Miles is by far the most unjustified and mysterious firing on the list in my opinion. He was .770 at LSU and did not have a big drop off at the end. He also had to play in the very tough SEC West Division. Kelly is .671 at Notre Dame. Kelly has easier scuedules than Miles. ND is also a more stories program than LSU. 5. Kelly vs Malzahn and Helfrich Malzahn record=32-17 in the SEC West Helfrich record= 35-12 Kelly record= 57-28 6. Brian Kelly vs Gene Chizik Based on objective evidence this is the only coach Kelly might be better than. Chizik was 33-19 at Auburn. In his NC year he was carried by Cam Newton. His 3-9 record in 2012 is the only season of any NC game coach that rivals Kelly's current season in godawfulness. Furthermore his 3-9 season was the only season at Auburn where he had none of Tuberville's recruits. However Chizik won his NC game while Kelly lost his. Edited October 18, 2016 by Araparseghianfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanscarborough Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) Look - the guy did a heck of a job at Cincy (not nearly the same program as it was when he left it), took ND to a NC and was two plays away from being back in the NC game with only 2 years lying between their last appearance. I get both sides of the argument. I can't ignore the 8-5's and definitely can't ignore the 2-5 to mediocre teams. I think I'm also being unfair to Kelly if I ignore 12 - 0 and a 10-3 year that was two plays (maybe injuries too) away from going to the playoff. When was the last time a "bad" coach, as you call him, had an undefeated team with a challenging schedule? I don't know how many teams go undefeated "in spite" of their coach. Undefeated in the regular season is a pretty exclusive club. Also - on the other side - how does a good coach go (2-5 against this schedule)? He's 2-5 but he has also had two great teams and two incredible seasons - - the best ND teams in decades. I think there may be a fair, accurate middle ground that the board is whiffing on when looking at what he's done. It's hard to reconcile the head scratchers with the two great seasons - - hard to sum up his career at ND. Think he get's next year and if he's smart makes major changes...think he posts at least 10 wins in 2017. Edited October 18, 2016 by seanscarborough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KamaraPolice Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Is pt the worst poster who won't ever go away? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamshaBua Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Is pt the worst poster who won't ever go away? Yes, it is scientifically incontrovertible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeaverIrish Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 look - the guy did a heck of a job at cincy (not nearly the same program as it was when he left it), took nd to a nc and was two plays away from being back in the nc game with only 2 years lying between their last appearance. i get both sides of the argument. I can't ignore the 8-5's and definitely can't ignore the 2-5 to mediocre teams. I think i'm also being unfair to kelly if i ignore 12 - 0 and a 10-3 year that was two plays (maybe injuries too) away from going to the playoff. When was the last time a "bad" coach, as you call him, had an undefeated team with a challenging schedule? I don't know how many teams go undefeated "in spite" of their coach. Undefeated in the regular season is a pretty exclusive club. Also - on the other side - how does a good coach go (2-5 against this schedule)? He's 2-5 but he has also had two great teams and two incredible seasons - - the best nd teams in decades. I think there may be a fair, accurate middle ground that the board is whiffing on when looking at what he's done. It's hard to reconcile the head scratchers with the two great seasons - - hard to sum up his career at nd. Think he get's next year and if he's smart makes major changes...think he posts at least 10 wins in 2017. huh?!?!?!?!?!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanscarborough Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 huh?!?!?!?!?!?! Haha was wrapping up at work and trying to type fast. Meant to say that he almost took the team to the NC and the CFB playoff in a 4-year span. That's impressive. And look, I don't think I'm suggesting anything outrageous. He's had several mediocre seasons, two outstanding seasons and now one miserable, terribly unforgivable season. He'll get one more year and I bet the Irish have a great season next year. Doesn't mean I think he is going to get a statue and win a NC at ND, but I'm not going to ignore the two phenomenal seasons he's had at ND. Just my thoughts guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndomer4 Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Look - the guy did a heck of a job at Cincy (not nearly the same program as it was when he left it), took ND to a NC and was two plays away from being back in the NC game with only 2 years lying between their last appearance. I get both sides of the argument. I can't ignore the 8-5's and definitely can't ignore the 2-5 to mediocre teams. I think I'm also being unfair to Kelly if I ignore 12 - 0 and a 10-3 year that was two plays (maybe injuries too) away from going to the playoff. When was the last time a "bad" coach, as you call him, had an undefeated team with a challenging schedule? I don't know how many teams go undefeated "in spite" of their coach. Undefeated in the regular season is a pretty exclusive club. Also - on the other side - how does a good coach go (2-5 against this schedule)? He's 2-5 but he has also had two great teams and two incredible seasons - - the best ND teams in decades. I think there may be a fair, accurate middle ground that the board is whiffing on when looking at what he's done. It's hard to reconcile the head scratchers with the two great seasons - - hard to sum up his career at ND. Think he get's next year and if he's smart makes major changes...think he posts at least 10 wins in 2017. Hate to break it to you but the two best irish teams in a decade is nothing to brag about lol. Let's face it he beat noone in 2015 and very easily could have won 9 games in 2012 if not for the worst game of Robinson's career, Pitt pretty much playing dead and Stanford where it just happened to be our night. Outside of Oklahoma and MSU in 2013 I can't think of any big wins off the top of my head. I am also basing that off how teams finish, sure FSU beating the number #5 team in week 7 was a big deal but was it a big deal when we finished 8-5? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goirish83 Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Lol my god stop with the dramatics pt. I'm not a kelly fan at this point and would be ecstatic if I woke up tomorrow to the news that he was fired but he has more wins then any active coach right now so no he's not the worst coach to ever coach in a championship game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ND in OH Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 To the OP .... are you a moron?? how about Larry Coker??? Took arguable one of the most talented teams in college football history history and lost to the sweater vest and the cheateyes in a game that should have never been close. You give that team to ANY coach worth a **** and they would have steamrolled O$U!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELDER06 Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Lol my god stop with the dramatics pt. I'm not a kelly fan at this point and would be ecstatic if I woke up tomorrow to the news that he was fired but he has more wins then any active coach right now so no he's not the worst coach to ever coach in a championship game The OP must have some type of fatal obsession Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dardo Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Haha was wrapping up at work and trying to type fast. Meant to say that he almost took the team to the NC and the CFB playoff in a 4-year span. That's impressive. And look, I don't think I'm suggesting anything outrageous. He's had several mediocre seasons, two outstanding seasons and now one miserable, terribly unforgivable season. He'll get one more year and I bet the Irish have a great season next year. Doesn't mean I think he is going to get a statue and win a NC at ND, but I'm not going to ignore the two phenomenal seasons he's had at ND. Just my thoughts guys! You have a way different definition of "outstanding" than I do I guess. My definition doesn't have ND barely beating Temple as their best win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTennant Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 How do they say it on the interwebs? This thread is full of win. We have a loaded opening statement followed by some fired shots.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KamaraPolice Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Not to encourage the twit, but to answer your question, in the modern bcs era, cheating gene chizik is the worst coach to play for a title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echo88 Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 How do they say it on the interwebs? This thread is full of win. We have a loaded opening statement followed by some fired shots.. It's almost like DD has suffered an era like this before.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocketsan Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 It's almost like DD has suffered an era like this before.... Several times since 1996 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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