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Edited March 3, 20159 yr by coastereight

Hopefully the NY Times or SI will see fit to do a series on it

Listening to the Mike and Mike show from this morning and I'm so irritated hearing Jesse Palmer say Bear Bryant could have 150 guys on scholarship and Saban can only have 85. Yeah and he still signs 125. Alabama signs 150% of the athletes that Notre Dame signs. Can we still win? Yes, but it's completely ridiculous to even think that this is okay.

 

As long as the student athletes are willing to be exploited in this manner, the trend will continue. The truth is, these kids would rather gamble on a spot playing for Alabama that take a certain spot with another team. That is their right to do so, and the school's right to take advantage.

 

I am against it, I think it is a terrible practice for an "institution of higher learning" to participate in an activity that will deprive at least x percent of their athletes the promised higher learning, but it is clear what the priority is for these universities.

 

Short answer run long. Real answer, it will stop when the athletes stop participating.

Theystill have to play with the same amount of guys as everyone else.

My question also how the hell are guys like Lacey considered academically eligible? What kind of courses are they taking? What a joke that this crap continues...

 

Like Nix said a while back, his buddies in SEC schools don't do anything academics wise...its all football. One injury away from the welfare line or flipping burgers at Mcds for life...a shame.

My question also how the hell are guys like Lacey considered academically eligible? What kind of courses are they taking? What a joke that this crap continues...

 

Like Nix said a while back, his buddies in SEC schools don't do anything academics wise...its all football. One injury away from the welfare line or flipping burgers at Mcds for life...a shame.

 

This is B.S.

 

At least relative to Alabama

 

Nick Saban is a Belichick guy. They understand the importance of brawn and brains.

 

Minimizing the dumbasses is key, and the dumbasses you do have must adhere or be gone.

 

Saban's cleaned Alabama up in a lot of ways, and his kids graduate at a pretty darned high rate relatively speaking.

 

He does a TON to maximize guys intellectually, mentally and physically.

 

There is a ton of support for those kids once they get there - which we do as well.

 

It isn't a meat factory.

 

I can't speak for the rest of the SEC, but who gives a shit about the rest of the SEC?

 

Alabama owns them much like they owned us.

 

Our coach follows a similar blueprint, and he'll get us there.

Sorry bing, you are almost 100%... Alabama is a meat factory to some degree.

I don't really know anything about over signing, but want to comment on academics. Notre Dame is a great university with high academics. awesome, good job, that's great, but how does that limit the type of football players that can come in?

obviously best case scenario is you have the higher academics and the best athletes to win multiple national championships. but if you had to pick one, what is it? higher academics and good (not great) football team? or lower academics and great football team? for me I want national champion type football team, so give me lower academics, but I have no ties/connection to the university part of Notre Dame. to me Notre Dame is a football team, and I want to see them WIN.

can Notre Dame have a perennial championship caliber team and still have high academics?

Theystill have to play with the same amount of guys as everyone else.

 

They just have a much larger pool of which to choose from...only 85 players on the scholarship. The problem is, they can take boarderline kids and if they don't work out...eh who cares we'll just max out again! We have to have classes of 17-18 kids to accommodate a large class of say 22-24. Alabama's lat 5 classes:

2012-26kids

2011-22kids

2010-26kids

2009-27kids

2008-32kids

That's an average 26.6 kids per year and a total of 133 kids signed in a 5 year period. Compare that to us:

2012-17

2011-23

2010-23

2009-18

2008-23

That's an average 20.8 kids per year and a total of 104 kids signed in a 5 year period.

 

That means they have 6 more players to work with every year.

Sorry bing, you are almost 100%... Alabama is a meat factory to some degree.

 

 

In some ways we all are. I'd say 95 percent of our football players would not be at Notre Dame without being great football players first.

 

My goodness, not to name any names but we have guys who admissions would privately laugh at had they just applied based on their schoolwork without football.

 

But we also understand they make a SHOTLOAD of money for the school, sooooooooooooo.

 

We'd all be lying if we claimed otherwise.

 

The thing is, we take care of them when thet get here, and if you've been paying attention to Nick's graduation rates he is too.

 

In that sense, Alabama has cleaned itself up in a big way.

 

Saban's made sure of that.

Yes, this argument has reared it's ugly head many times . Kelly is on his way to proving it... It is also reportedly one of the main reasons our wonderful AD chosen ND. It has been done and it will be done again!

 

Brian Kelly is still the truth. We are on our way.

 

Also, the team played their worst game of he season outside of BYU.

This last post was in response to lowering NDs academic standards .

 

 

 

What are his graduation rates????????

How about AA players?

What kind of degrees are these Bama guys graduating with...no doubt the majority are joke degrees meant only to keep the players eligible.

 

No way in hell Lacey is taking anything relevant to him in the real world should he get injured and need his bama degree...

 

Their team is loaded with jucos....and they definitely are not enrolling with calculus prereqs...did you hear Lacey speak last night...football is his one and only ticket...and considering the avg nfl career is what 4 years...when he blows out a knee or is released by some team...saban will be long gone from bama and wont give two s.hits about him....

 

Look at the thugs under meyers watch at uf...how many arrests were there while he looked away...etc...

 

The SEC apart from vandy is slime.

This is B.S.

 

At least relative to Alabama

 

Nick Saban is a Belichick guy. They understand the importance of brawn and brains.

 

Minimizing the dumbasses is key, and the dumbasses you do have must adhere or be gone.

 

Saban's cleaned Alabama up in a lot of ways, and his kids graduate at a pretty darned high rate relatively speaking.

 

He does a TON to maximize guys intellectually, mentally and physically.

 

There is a ton of support for those kids once they get there - which we do as well.

 

It isn't a meat factory.

 

I can't speak for the rest of the SEC, but who gives a shit about the rest of the SEC?

 

Alabama owns them much like they owned us.

 

Our coach follows a similar blueprint, and he'll get us there.

 

Nice use of qualifiers.

 

Do all the Alabama athletes receive four year degrees?

Nice use of qualifiers.

 

Do all the Alabama athletes receive four year degrees?

 

No, but the majority under Nick are. It's up to 75 percent.

 

They aren't treating these kids like meat.

 

And he doesn't recruit a bunch of idiots.

No, but the majority under Nick are. It's up to 75 percent.

 

They aren't treating these kids like meat.

 

And he doesn't recruit a bunch of idiots.

 

I miswrote. Actually, I meant 4 year scholarships, and it is something I legitimately do not know.

Look at last year. I still think Darby used us and out guarantee of honoring his scholarship as an insurance policy his senior year. He verballed and the NEXT day after the season ended opened up his recruitment. He said SLL the right things about the importance of education and a "40 year decision" to go to FSU. The universities that engage in over recruiting aren't GUARANTEED to win, but like the Yanks and Sox in baseball, they begin with an advantage.

No, but the majority under Nick are. It's up to 75 percent.

 

They aren't treating these kids like meat.

 

And he doesn't recruit a bunch of idiots.

 

A few questions:

 

(1) How rigorous do you think a BA at Alabama is versus at ND?

(2) Can Bama players major in "general studies" like at many state schools? Are they pursuing real programs of study?

(3) Don't you think all of the grayshirted players at Bama are treated like meat? What about underperformers who find their scholarships pulled to make room for new 5* players? My sense is that Bama's camps are more like tryouts. They're eventually going to find a way to weed out the weak links.

 

http://oversigning.com/testing/index.php/tag/alabama/

One of the announcers for ESPN after the game said this about the SEC last night after something may have slipped about Bama cheating or something:

 

"If you arent cheating, you arent trying. That's the SEC."

 

People know that teams in the SEC are cheating, they just dont care.

No, but the majority under Nick are. It's up to 75 percent.

 

They aren't treating these kids like meat.

 

And he doesn't recruit a bunch of idiots.

 

Care to address the over signing issue you seemed to have downplayed?

 

 

Also, I love that 75% number you list. It's cute. That's actually the GSR, Graduation Success Rate. Which is the graduation rate of kids that don't go elsewhere. Why is this relevant? Well my good man, that's because the GSR doesn't count kids that "transfer," which is the ENTIRE argument we're having here with this over signing stuff.

 

What gray shirting is and what the over-signing practice allows for...is Nick will sign 25-28 kids every year. The kids who get injured or don't cut it initially will be sent to a Junior College, if they prove worthy of coming back, they can come back. It allows Saban to take fliers on kids. So you can sign that 3* LB, hope he makes gains in the weight room, maybe grows an inch or two and then bring him back into the fold without harming your 85 man roster.

 

As coastereight pointed out. For every 4 recruiting classes we have, Alabama has 5.

No, but the majority under Nick are. It's up to 75 percent.

 

They aren't treating these kids like meat.

 

And he doesn't recruit a bunch of idiots.

 

Wow a graduation rate of 75%! That's something worth bragging about there! Whatever. Nick Saban's book when he retires will be titled The Art Of Cheating In College Football!!