phillyirishfan Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Why cant Notre Dame run the ball. Its killing knowing they cant run the ball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 It is frustrating, but as long as we have 300+ yards passing and a win, I'm fine. It will catch up to us eventually though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErickJD08 Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 I think its all coaching. I was rewatching the game and slowing down the play to get an idea of why there were players in the backfield and its a little sad. In two instances, there was a Stanford DL that was getting through even though he was double teamed. There was another instance where it seemed like a defensive player was blocked into a play which was sad. Maybe the OL is not sure of where the play is going. There was another play where Wenger, the center, was pulling and he looked like he wasn't sure who to block. Wenger was shuffling across the line. If he would have ran to his spot across the line, he could have blocked the LB and opened up a nice run. Its sad, they are juniors and seniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will munny Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Strength and conditioning and offensive line coaching are the reasons why we suck at running the ball, imo. We're getting by ok though because Latina has got the o line playing a lot better pass protection. If we ever get a run game at ND with Weis and Clausen......look out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarney_stank Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Give the coaching thing a break boys. The OL is doing a nice job pass protecting so it isn't like there hasn't been improvement over last year. This line is continuing to grow and gain confidence. We have seen an up and down running game that should improve as the year goes on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Fence Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 We had a few untimely holding penalties that certainly weren't the cause of the problem but did compound it. Grimes got flagged in the 4th when Hughes probably would have had the first down anyway. That would have given us a new set of downs rather than setting up second and long. As many of you mentioned, it starts with the push / drive. We haven't been able to blow people off the line to create any space. Some of this is S&C, some is scheme, positioning and adjustments. On a lot of plays, I saw some of our guys essentially give up on a block at the LOS and then try to release downfield to block someone else when the original man they tried blocking stayed at the LOS and made the tackle for no gain. If you want to watch how run blocking should be done, watch the tape of the UM game last year and the job Jake Long did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Chris Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 We had a few untimely holding penalties that certainly weren't the cause of the problem but did compound it. Grimes got flagged in the 4th when Hughes probably would have had the first down anyway. That would have given us a new set of downs rather than setting up second and long. As many of you mentioned, it starts with the push / drive. We haven't been able to blow people off the line to create any space. Some of this is S&C, some is scheme, positioning and adjustments. On a lot of plays, I saw some of our guys essentially give up on a block at the LOS and then try to release downfield to block someone else when the original man they tried blocking stayed at the LOS and made the tackle for no gain. If you want to watch how run blocking should be done, watch the tape of the UM game last year and the job Jake Long did. The problem with that is that there are no Jake Longs on this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian_Irish Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 There is no reason the team shouldnt be albe to run the ball decently behind the RG and RT. Not having a good blocking TE is also hurting right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirodomer Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Blarney, with all due respect. We couldn't run the ball much better when Brady and Darius was here either. This is not something that is going to get better on a consistent basis until some coaching changes are made. I commend the line coach for protecting JC better this year. The running game is pathetic and you guys will hopefully realize this next year when the next "Saviour" 5 star running back shows up and then wishes he went to a school that can run block! How much do you want to bet that a lot of our running backs make NFL teams as free agents and then find themselves starting on an NFL team and tearing it up because they actually have a hole to run through! That's how much talent I think we have in our backfield! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishCalves Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 (edited) Blarney, with all due respect. We couldn't run the ball much better when Brady and Darius was here either. This is not something that is going to get better on a consistent basis until some coaching changes are made. I commend the line coach for protecting JC better this year. The running game is pathetic and you guys will hopefully realize this next year when the next "Saviour" 5 star running back shows up and then wishes he went to a school that can run block! How much do you want to bet that a lot of our running backs make NFL teams as free agents and then find themselves starting on an NFL team and tearing it up because they actually have a hole to run through! That's how much talent I think we have in our backfield! Thats a bunch of crap, with all due respect, because I'm not taking this out on you personally. i just don't buy your argument at all. Darius was a 1,000 yard rusher during both years he was in South Bend with Weis. Had 13 games under Weis where he ran for more than 100 in a game, which averages to about half of his games. Thats a HECK of a lot better than what we've been doing, where we got RBBC and are lucky to get over 100 as a team. He was also way more efficient with his touches, going for 4.7 and 5.0 yards per carry in each of those two seasons. He wasn't a guy you pound 30 times a a game every week, because he was a guy who got nicked up so often but kept playing through a bum ankle or a bruise here or there, but he was very, very solid. Just because he didn't cut it as a pro, don't underscore what he accomplished with the Irish. Some of it is coaching (the cut blocking we do drives me nuts), but some of it is the players quite simply not executing. The coaches can't go out there and do it for them. And as for our backfield, Hughes looks slow and is dancing, Aldridge gets taken off his feet rather easily for a 220 pounder, and Allen has been solid but can't hold up for a full season. There's recruiting hype, and then there is what our eyes can tell us in the here and the now. Complex problems don't have simple solutions, much as we want them to be. Edited October 7, 2008 by IrishCalves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarney_stank Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Blarney, with all due respect. We couldn't run the ball much better when Brady and Darius was here either. This is not something that is going to get better on a consistent basis until some coaching changes are made. I commend the line coach for protecting JC better this year. The running game is pathetic and you guys will hopefully realize this next year when the next "Saviour" 5 star running back shows up and then wishes he went to a school that can run block! How much do you want to bet that a lot of our running backs make NFL teams as free agents and then find themselves starting on an NFL team and tearing it up because they actually have a hole to run through! That's how much talent I think we have in our backfield! Chiro, we've both been on here long enough for you to know to call me Stank, not blarney. Cmon bro. Listen, I understand where your and other's frutstration lies with respect to the running game. I am frustrated as well. As Calves stated, this is a more complex problem then just saying replace the coach. Personally, from last year to this year I have seen progress in both run and pass protection. It's just that pass protection is being done more consistently well then run blocking at this point in time. Like it or not, some of that may come down to repitition, identity, and expectation. We throw the ball more then we run. With our weapons in the receiving game, we should. This provides more reps for the OL to gel from. I've seen many complain that we had no identity, well now we do and it just isn't as a run first team right now. Another big issue is expecation. Because of last year, many of us were so concerned about pass protection and saw the size of the right size of our OL that we assumed run blocking was going to be our bread and butter. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked out that way which goes contrary to expectation. We have seen glimpses of a good running attack, just look at Purdue and Michigan. I hope and expect those glimpses to increase in frequency as the year progresses. To Calves point, the one thing that boggles my mind is why we see good execution in the running game one week and poor execution another. Is there something the coaches are doing or not doing or is this purely a player thing? Until we figure that out, I don't think we will have a solution. That said, I continue to see progress, I just want the run game to become more consistent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ND FANATIC Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Calves, I think the answer to this really is quite simple. First of all its coaching, and I won't get into all of that again its been stated a thousand times. Secondly, I honestly think that we don't want to be a running team. I think that CW and MH are quite content having a running game that needs to be respected enough to open up the passing game, but isn't really a threat like we all want it to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Fence Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Calves, Secondly, I honestly think that we don't want to be a running team. I think that CW and MH are quite content having a running game that needs to be respected enough to open up the passing game, but isn't really a threat like we all want it to be. I think there is a LOT of truth to that. That is how it's done in the NFL - outside of a few places like perhaps Minnesota that are REALLY committed to the run, teams use it as an off-balance play to set up good down and distance situations for the pass, and in some special occasions like trying to run out a clock at the end of a game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirodomer Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Sorry Stank! It was late! Anyway, the line that blocked for DWalk was taught by another offensive line coach. Lil Tuna was lucky to inherit seasoned players on the line. These are his picks coached by his O-line choice. Look at OSU. Their running back is 4'11" and 115 pounds and he is as strong as the day is long. 40 carries against the battered hollywood actors and actresses! We have good players. We have a lot of good coaches. We need an O-line coach. Again, sorry Stank! It was probably the microwave spaghetti and halloween candy talking! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nofairweather Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I must agree that our oline is struggling at run blocking. The entire country knows this is a problem. I have no dobt that the coaches are practicing runs all week. I believe that as our passing game becomes more respected each week defenses are going to start to loosen up to keep from getting burned by JC and our dominating young recievers. Once this happens our stable of stud RB's will start chewing up major yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddThomas Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 For the following reasons: We run a pro-style offense predicated upon the pass. Inability to break long runs, which drags down our average to 3.3 yds/att.(ie. we lack a game breaker back) Takes 3 years of college ball to develope outstanding linemen. Defense is bend not break, limiting our opportunities on offense. After last years debacle we emphasized pass blocking to the detriment of run blocking. Only two games did we use the pass to set up the run, Mich & Purdue As you can see I haven't given up on our line's ability to open holes, with Rudolph and Floyd now as starters teams would be foolish to stack the box on us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crouchingjedi Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Like it or not, some of that may come down to repitition, identity, and expectation. We throw the ball more then we run. With our weapons in the receiving game, we should. This provides more reps for the OL to gel from. I've seen many complain that we had no identity, well now we do and it just isn't as a run first team right now. Kind of what I was thinking--we probably practice passing plays so much more than running plays during practice. It's a catch 22 right now because we have so much talent and playmaking ability in our passing game and that must be developed as well. But OL run blocking is all about technique and if we aren't hammering that technique ad nauseum in practice then we will pay for it. I just find it so frustrating that in a 3rd and short we can never seem to convert on a run against teams like San Diego St, Mich St, and STanford. This is so puzzling and frustrating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstokes Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 For the following reasons: We run a pro-style offense predicated upon the pass. Inability to break long runs, which drags down our average to 3.3 yds/att.(ie. we lack a game breaker back) Takes 3 years of college ball to develope outstanding linemen. Defense is bend not break, limiting our opportunities on offense. After last years debacle we emphasized pass blocking to the detriment of run blocking. Only two games did we use the pass to set up the run, Mich & Purdue As you can see I haven't given up on our line's ability to open holes, with Rudolph and Floyd now as starters teams would be foolish to stack the box on us. I have to disagree with you on your view of the defense. We are far from a bend don't break philosophy. It might appear statistic wise that we are that kind of D, but we are as aggressive as anyone in the country, just not good at it yet. We show great confidence in our dbacks in our blitzes and they are coming up big for us so far. We just need to get better on the Dline and more crisp in our pursuit of the QB/backs and we will be very tough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddThomas Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 How else do you explain us being 84th in total defense and 40th in scoring defense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishGuy Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 How else do you explain us being 84th in total defense and 40th in scoring defense? Luck.....lot's and lots of luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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