The recipe I'm using is the Lou Holtz 1988 recipe so it might need a bit of updating

• Power running game
• QB who can run/complete deep passes
• Speed
• Defense
• Relentless Recruiting

 

Help me update and improve the recipe and discuss please!

Easy. A motivational coach. 

An offensive coordinator who creates great game plans and makes needed in-game adjustments. Ditto defensive coordinator. 
5 star players at multiple positions. 

Score more points than your opponents. 

 

 

Edited January 31, 20222 yr by cali_domer

I love where you're going with this and it should be a fun conversation. I also like where you're going, though I'd tweak it a bit.

• Power running game - No doubt here, though, you could simplify this to winning the trenches (although, that may be too vague)
  • I think I might change this to experienced depth in the Oline and a separate bullet of rusher that can push a pile
• QB who can run/complete deep passes - I think more important is having a playmaker. Stetson didn't have a great deep ball, it certainly was worse than Bryce's, IMHO. Buuuut, he just made more plays. This the same with guys like Watson or Lawrence or Rice ....they had mobility and arm talent, but what truly separated them is that they made more plays than the opposing QB in any game they played. Leinart ended up being trash but I'll be damned if he didn't make more critical plays in CFB (that frickin 4th down completion still kills me).
• Speed - too vague, but yes. And, I might express it as skilled speed. 
• Defense - way too vague, IMHO. You definitely need defense but what makes it championship level?
  • Like offense, you gotta win the trenches
  • I think you need a killer leader, ideally in the LB corps but I think some teams do it in the secondary. Someone behind a killer dline that the unit rallies around.
• Relentless Recruiting - I'd express this as something like >=92 avg recruit score on 247. You have to have multiple years in that top cluster (traditionally inhabited by OSU, Bama ...and more recently, Georgia)
  
  Some Additional
  I'd add special teams to this. I think the great teams almost always kill it in the third unit. I think of Meyer's UF teams that had all the headline guys in that space and just slayed there.
  A coach that plays to win. You have to go for the throat at all times. Those teams that play not to lose get separated at that highest level. 
  Most importantly, you need a team full of the types of players whose lives hinge on winning. Call it culture, but a culture where winning matters and, really, is the only thing that matters. This is especially true of programs that sustain championship caliber play. You observe this in places like ST where a team can play technically proficient but a championship team plays to assert its will.

ND is in a different spot than other legitimate title contenders (Bama, UGA, Ohio State). So, the recipe is different.

• Legitimate NFL caliber QB - talking First Round talent, not Day Three talent
• One of the Top 5 OL in the county
• Playmakers at the skill positions: Kyren, Will Fuller, Golden Tate, Michael Floyd... on the same team
• Great front seven with speed at LB
• CFP caliber secondary
• Great staff with an emphasis on recruiting

ND is behind in terms of QB (too early to say either way on Buchner), skill position playmakers, and having a solid secondary. ND's OL could potentially be great in 2022 and beyond with elite talent and one of the best OL coaches in the county. I thought LB was a weakness last season with White and Bertrand, but that should change going forward with Freeman's LB recruiting. LBs should be improved in 2022 and potentially great in 2023 if the young guys develop. DL has been ND's best position the last few seasons, and even though Elston is gone, I think ND is doing really well recruiting and developing elite DL talent. We will see who Freeman hires at DC, but I think his staff could potentially be great.

This basically all comes down to recruiting. ND had the #6/#7 class in 2022. They need to be Top 5 with at least 6-8 guys in the Top 100 going forward. That's not quire Bama/UGA level, but it gets them much closer. They need to stack classes like that for at least three cycles to make a serious run at a title. Freeman should be able to get ND closer to that level. 

1 hour ago, tneun89 said:

ND is in a different spot than other legitimate title contenders (Bama, UGA, Ohio State). So, the recipe is different.

• Legitimate NFL caliber QB - talking First Round talent, not Day Three talent
• One of the Top 5 OL in the county
• Playmakers at the skill positions: Kyren, Will Fuller, Golden Tate, Michael Floyd... on the same team
• Great front seven with speed at LB
• CFP caliber secondary
• Great staff with an emphasis on recruiting

ND is behind in terms of QB (too early to say either way on Buchner), skill position playmakers, and having a solid secondary. ND's OL could potentially be great in 2022 and beyond with elite talent and one of the best OL coaches in the county. I thought LB was a weakness last season with White and Bertrand, but that should change going forward with Freeman's LB recruiting. LBs should be improved in 2022 and potentially great in 2023 if the young guys develop. DL has been ND's best position the last few seasons, and even though Elston is gone, I think ND is doing really well recruiting and developing elite DL talent. We will see who Freeman hires at DC, but I think his staff could potentially be great.

This basically all comes down to recruiting. ND had the #6/#7 class in 2022. They need to be Top 5 with at least 6-8 guys in the Top 100 going forward. That's not quire Bama/UGA level, but it gets them much closer. They need to stack classes like that for at least three cycles to make a serious run at a title. Freeman should be able to get ND closer to that level. 

Is the recipe really that different for other title contenders? 1st round QB, Great OL, Playmakers at the skilled positions; Great front 7; CFP Secondary; Staff who can recruit and coach?   🙂

Add in luck and avoidance of injuries....

3 hours ago, jbrown_9999 said:

Is the recipe really that different for other title contenders? 1st round QB, Great OL, Playmakers at the skilled positions; Great front 7; CFP Secondary; Staff who can recruit and coach?   🙂

I was just thinking about Georgia and how they really won with a truly dominant defense and a former walk-on, future UDFA at QB. UGA can win without a First Round QB, but I don't think ND can. UGA has so much talent everywhere else, especially on defense, that I think their blueprint can be slightly different. I think ND needs to lean on their OL and have a true NFL QB (of the Quinn, Clausen variety, at least - doesn't necessarily need to be a Burrow or Lawrence, although that would sure help).

I think teams like UGA and Alabama (and maybe Ohio State) could win without a QB because the rest of their roster is so talented, but ND will never have as many Top 100 guys as those teams.

24 minutes ago, tneun89 said:

I was just thinking about Georgia and how they really won with a truly dominant defense and a former walk-on, future UDFA at QB. UGA can win without a First Round QB, but I don't think ND can. UGA has so much talent everywhere else, especially on defense, that I think their blueprint can be slightly different. I think ND needs to lean on their OL and have a true NFL QB (of the Quinn, Clausen variety, at least - doesn't necessarily need to be a Burrow or Lawrence, although that would sure help).

I think teams like UGA and Alabama (and maybe Ohio State) could win without a QB because the rest of their roster is so talented, but ND will never have as many Top 100 guys as those teams.

I was thinking something similar. Dominant Bama hasn't always had a blue chip QB but when they don't they have a solid defense and a good running game. I don't think McCarron or McElroy were amazing but they had solid supporting cast members. 

Pretty much the formula the last 40 years. Just the style or way of doing it is different. 

On 1/30/2022 at 11:38 AM, FaithInIrishForever said:

The recipe I'm using is the Lou Holtz 1988 recipe so it might need a bit of updating

• Power running game
• QB who can run/complete deep passes
• Speed
• Defense
• Relentless Recruiting

 

Help me update and improve the recipe and discuss please!

• Accurate QB who has the arm strength to stretch the field 
• Solid LT, overall strong OL

• 1 deep threat at WR

• Reliable run game

• Good situational Defense, IE can get off the field on 3rd down and limit Offenses to FGs in the Red Zone

 

On 1/31/2022 at 4:06 PM, EddieAngel said:

I was thinking something similar. Dominant Bama hasn't always had a blue chip QB but when they don't they have a solid defense and a good running game. I don't think McCarron or McElroy were amazing but they had solid supporting cast members. 

That was a different era, Bama adapted to the change in the game when they hired Kiffin. UGA’s formula for winning is an outlier.

On 1/31/2022 at 3:38 PM, tneun89 said:

I was just thinking about Georgia and how they really won with a truly dominant defense and a former walk-on, future UDFA at QB. UGA can win without a First Round QB, but I don't think ND can. UGA has so much talent everywhere else, especially on defense, that I think their blueprint can be slightly different. I think ND needs to lean on their OL and have a true NFL QB (of the Quinn, Clausen variety, at least - doesn't necessarily need to be a Burrow or Lawrence, although that would sure help).

I think teams like UGA and Alabama (and maybe Ohio State) could win without a QB because the rest of their roster is so talented, but ND will never have as many Top 100 guys as those teams.

Exactly. They need to be built more like the Clemson title teams.