Posted November 2, 20213 yr comment_733013 1. Lack of range at linebacker 2. Lack of depth at corner 3. Inconsistent gap assignments 4. inexperience at corner 5, not utilizing the D-line consistently, 3down 4 down 6. Injuries at LB and now FS 7. tackling fundamentals, Thank you NDfanatic and soulpatch 8. time in this system/scheme fits. Thank you OkelleyIrish 9. Finishing the play/appropriate pursuit. thanks NDHoosier That felt good. I encourage you to join in. Not using the tagging feature this time though I like it.
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733050 35 minutes ago, ndfanatic78 said: Lack of tackling ability If I had to bet that has to to do with the lack of range too, because its like taking a charge in basketball if you beat the guy to the spot its easier to get your feet settled and wrap-up/
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733054 20 minutes ago, FaithInIrishForever said: If I had to bet that has to to do with the lack of range too, because its like taking a charge in basketball if you beat the guy to the spot its easier to get your feet settled and wrap-up/ I see it differently. We're not making tackles from the dline or secondary as well, IMHO. We are generating pressure from the rush and consistently letting the QB escape after contact. I'm sure range and things like gap integrity factor into this but it's so pervasive an issue that I, personally, look at it as an issue in and of itself.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733056 Need to have patience with scheme adaption, and getting players to fit the scheme. Next year's LBs will go a long way IMO. Need to do a lot better recruiting DBs.
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733057 4 minutes ago, OKelleyIrish said: Need to have patience with scheme adaption, and getting players to fit the scheme. Next year's LBs will go a long way IMO. Need to do a lot better recruiting DBs. I agree 100 percent with patience. I made a poll a few months ago about growing pains on defense. and wanted follow up with a strengths and weaknesses thread. So at the end of the season look for a strengths or growth thread maybe if you want we can collaborate?
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733058 20 minutes ago, soulpatch said: I see it differently. We're not making tackles from the dline or secondary as well, IMHO. We are generating pressure from the rush and consistently letting the QB escape after contact. I'm sure range and things like gap integrity factor into this but it's so pervasive an issue that I, personally, look at it as an issue in and of itself. You correctly Identify two parts. 1. getting there 2. act of tackling- fundamentally getting the ball carrier on the ground
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733059 3 minutes ago, FaithInIrishForever said: I agree 100 percent with patience. I made a poll a few months ago about growing pains on defense. and wanted follow up with a strengths and weaknesses thread. So at the end of the season look for a strengths or growth thread maybe if you want we can collaborate? Sure. Happy to help. I think it's really difficult though lol. One would really have to have a good grasp on Cinci's D while Freeman was there, and be able to kinda line things up by position. Otherwise, it's just kind of grade individuals, or perhaps the units as the year went along. Do we have anyone here that watched a lot of Cinci the last couple years?
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733060 Just now, OKelleyIrish said: Sure. Happy to help. I think it's really difficult though lol. One would really have to have a good grasp on Cinci's D while Freeman was there, and be able to kinda line things up by position. Otherwise, it's just kind of grade individuals, or perhaps the units as the year went along. Do we have anyone here that watched a lot of Cinci the last couple years? Agreed. I know the goal at corner is to get where Cincy is now, tall guys who can cover Linebacker- I think he needs the tall long guys that he recruited D-Line more power rushers then speed. He likes coverage sacks not traditional pass rush. Safety again more coverage its a pass defense first.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733064 The defense has the speed to get there, they are reading the defense pretty well, they are overpowering/outmaneuvering the Oline, but they are just not finishing the tackle. The UNC game was quite frustrating to watch because the defense always seemed to be in good position (except that one play), they just could not finish it. Edited November 3, 20213 yr by NDhoosier
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733067 2 minutes ago, NDhoosier said: The defense has the speed to get there, they are reading to the defense pretty well, they are overpowering/outmaneuvering the Oline, but they are just not finishing the tackle. The UNC was quite frustrating to watch because they defense always seemed to be in good position (except that one play), they just could not finish it. Thanks NDhoosier added that to the opening post as well.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733068 1 hour ago, OKelleyIrish said: Need to have patience with scheme adaption, and getting players to fit the scheme. Next year's LBs will go a long way IMO. Need to do a lot better recruiting DBs. He shouldn’t have changed the scheme if he didn’t have the players to play the new scheme. Any good coach worth a lick will adapt his scheme to the players he has not stick a round peg in a square hole. I will give Freeman some leeway because the defense has a ton of injuries, but that’s about it.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733069 10 minutes ago, NDhoosier said: The defense has the speed to get there, they are reading to the defense pretty well, they are overpowering/outmaneuvering the Oline, but they are just not finishing the tackle. The UNC was quite frustrating to watch because they defense always seemed to be in good position (except that one play), they just could not finish it. There were plenty of times the dline did not contain their lanes and let the QB escape through the middle of the pocket. That is either coaching or stubborn players not listening to coaching. Edited November 3, 20213 yr by ndfanatic78
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733070 Just now, ndfanatic78 said: He shouldn’t have changed the scheme if he didn’t have the players to play the new scheme. Any good coach worth a lick will adapt his scheme to the players he has not stick a round peg in a square hole. I will give Freeman some leeway because the defense has a ton of injuries, but that’s about it. Doesn't work like that. And we're not even going from a 4-3 to a 3-4. We're going to a flex system (4-3 and 3-4), that uses a "big" DE and a Vyper, and just prioritizes things differently. More chaos, more coverage, more looks... You're not going to hire a guy, then sit around in a scheme he doesn't coach, and loose a year of teaching just waiting on a new recruiting cycle.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733071 What do you mean it doesn’t work like that? What doesn’t work like that? That good coaches adapt to their players and not force their system on the kids? Because it does work that way unless you are that great of a coach.
November 3, 20213 yr Author comment_733072 5 minutes ago, ndfanatic78 said: What do you mean it doesn’t work like that? What doesn’t work like that? That good coaches adapt to their players and not force their system on the kids? Because it does work that way unless you are that great of a coach. Agree to a point. Its hard to ask Year 1 freeman to compare to year 3 Lea
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733074 33 minutes ago, ndfanatic78 said: What do you mean it doesn’t work like that? What doesn’t work like that? That good coaches adapt to their players and not force their system on the kids? Because it does work that way unless you are that great of a coach. I normally completely agree with. That coaches should adapt. But for this instance, I wouldn’t think many people would have much success with Myron and Hinish as your starting Nose and Defensive End. No offense to those guys because I think they have played above potential, but it doesn’t scream too 10 defense. Neither does Bertrand and White(who was originally on the scout team). Pencil in Griffin who didn’t play until this year and had to be asked back and you’re asking a lot from this defense. I guess I’m saying, this defense was never going to be lights out. Not even top 20. So, I had low expectations. It’s the same way people got upset when the o-line was playing bad this year. What were people expecting? They knew who was coming back. It is what it is this year.
November 3, 20213 yr comment_733081 42 minutes ago, ndfanatic78 said: What do you mean it doesn’t work like that? What doesn’t work like that? That good coaches adapt to their players and not force their system on the kids? Because it does work that way unless you are that great of a coach. Waiting a year wasn't going to change much. And IMO, we haven't gone full tilt new scheme, at least not on the back end. Our DBs were going to be weak aside from Kyle in any system. Our LBs were going to be weak in any system. Our DL was seen as deep, and had the players that were seen as having traits to adjust now (MTA to BigE, Foskey to WDE/Vyper). And like I said this wasn't a wholesale flip to like a from a 4-3 to a 3-4, or vice versa. And he only uses one pure pass rusher anyway regardless of 3 or 4 man front. And honestly, we didn't have a lot of pure pass rushers anyway. He uses bigs on the interior, and we had them. Aside from the obvious difference, his scheme begs you to attack the C gap. So in short, we have the right traits on the DL for his scheme, just need to learn it. The big change on the backend was more cover 1 and 3. And Kyle is about as perfect as a FS or Sniper you can ask for for either scheme. He's gone now... but obviously did well doing what he was asked to do. Overall we were lame at S other than Kyle. The CBs were going to be week regardless of going C1, 2, or 3. We have not recruited well in this area. Waiting doesn't change anything. LB wise, injury killed us in a lot of ways before the season started. IMO they should play Bo more at Mike, and move Drew out to WILL or let Kollie start at WILL. I'd prefer to keep Kiser at Rover. Not sure why Bertrand was getting so much PT. Overall, we did take baby steps or half steps with LB and DBs. You'll see that continue to evolve next year with more 3 safety looks.
November 4, 20213 yr comment_733121 17 hours ago, FaithInIrishForever said: Agree to a point. Its hard to ask Year 1 freeman to compare to year 3 Lea I was mulling this the other day (why Lea seemed to transition better than Freeman has). Lea had a 4th year in that Elko set up basically the same system for Lea. But, I do think there are some things Freeman needs to prove (can he grow into the role).
November 4, 20213 yr Author comment_733169 10 hours ago, soulpatch said: I was mulling this the other day (why Lea seemed to transition better than Freeman has). Lea had a 4th year in that Elko set up basically the same system for Lea. But, I do think there are some things Freeman needs to prove (can he grow into the role). Very good point. As @OKelleyIrish points out patience is key. While the scheme looks similar it changes the entire pass coverage philosophy. So instead of quarters where the safeties drive things, this is Cover 1 or 3 with alot of linebacker pass rush and coverage responsibly. Then they lost JOK their best coverage linebacker, best havoc linebacker too, ND will improve each year under Freeman. Elko had the opportunity to coach after BVG so he could show improvement by teaching fundamentals. But fundamentals alone don't beat Bama its speed its power all found through recruiting.
1. Lack of range at linebacker
2. Lack of depth at corner
3. Inconsistent gap assignments
4. inexperience at corner
5, not utilizing the D-line consistently, 3down 4 down
6. Injuries at LB and now FS
7. tackling fundamentals, Thank you NDfanatic and soulpatch
8. time in this system/scheme fits. Thank you OkelleyIrish
9. Finishing the play/appropriate pursuit. thanks NDHoosier
That felt good. I encourage you to join in. Not using the tagging feature this time though I like it.