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2-4 vs 5-1


5-1 vs 2-4  

31 members have voted

  1. 1. how lucky Do we fans feel to be 5-1

    • Very
      18
    • Somewhat
      11
    • NOT AT ALL
      2


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The games ND won by lets use "The Spread" knowing I have no idea what the spread for the games was.

I would say ND covered vs Wisconsin and Purdue.

I would say the other performances were somewhat below  expectation

With a few missed kicks the FSU, VT and Toledo game WERE CLOSE

So would you rather 

 

A look at  the season like ND is fortunate to be 5-1

Or do you think ND should always be 6-0

 

 

 

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I don’t ever think ND should win every game. 
It seems like before this season began, most people thought ND would lose at least two regular season games; probably most people thought three. 
Being 5-1 is pretty great. They haven’t looked good doing it, but here they are.  Fortunate?  Maybe. But they have been the best team on the field each week. They’ve been out-coached in my opinion, but they are a good team. 
I won’t be at all surprised if they win the rest of their games and a good bowl game. 

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I don’t know if it was Prister or who on his show but they nailed exactly how i felt going into the season.  And exactly how I would feel if ND finished 11-1. This would be a Kelly’s best coaching job if they finished twitch that record. 
I actually had them pegged at 10-2 this season. They lost Book and a to. Of talent last year. So, when they lost I didn’t go full melt down blow-up like I usually do. I half expected. 
BUT, when you are 4-0 playing at home and a chance to improve your standing, I felt they needed to win that game. It was another one of those BK moments. 
Either way, what’s done is done and I’d be happy with 11-1 if that happens. 
I’d be a little disappointed with a loss at this point knowing how the second half of the schedule is shaping up. But ND still hasn’t looked great either. So, one more loss would be that upsetting. 
So, greatful at this moment. 

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What is frustrating to me is that a lot of potential blame for the loss & close wins this year seem to be due to some assistant coaches being less than "A" hires and past recruiting/prospect evaluation/development shortfalls. Should ND have needed to have a true freshman LT be its #1 LT and count on a MAC transfer for RG? Should ND be grab-bagging at the QB position? Should ND's WRs have had more prior game experience? 

Edited by jbrown_9999
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11 hours ago, jbrown_9999 said:

What is frustrating to me is that a lot of potential blame for the loss & close wins this year seem to be due to some assistant coaches being less than "A" hires and past recruiting/prospect evaluation/development shortfalls. Should ND have needed to have a true freshman LT be its #1 LT and count on a MAC transfer for RG? Should ND be grab-bagging at the QB position? Should ND's WRs have had more prior game experience? 

I look at it two ways. You can go the Clemson route that hasn’t accepted a transfer yet. Look where they are at. Or you can go the ND route and try to grab a few in hopes it works out. It’s hit or miss on the transfer trail. There’s a reason these guys are transferring a lot of times. It’s that they can’t beat the competition. 
The drum I will beat with you is ND and the QB situation. We should be somewhat established by now. Book a former three star, albeit won a lot of games shouldn’t be what Kelly hangs his hat on. They need that generational player by now. That’s what needs to improve now. 
In terms of assistant hirings. The Rees hire I was disappointed in. But he knows what it’s like to be a qb at ND and he’s young. I think he’s brought a different feel for Kelly’s offense. I’m ok so far with what he’s done. 
Quinn. Eh, not so much.  But, we are seeing what’s happening now and they should look to replace him at the end of the year. I think they can do better and look for the best at this point. 

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ND wasn’t lucky to win a few of those games, they were the better team and should have won more handily. They almost gave it away a number of times, like the FSU game. Going into the season, I expected to see a few losses, so 5-1 at this point is good. 

Was hoping the O-line would be better. Don’t have a problem with a freshman starting left tackle. We haven’t seen much of Blake Fisher, but maybe he really is that good to be a freshman and starting at LT. The transfer from Marshall, Cain Madden, has been a disappointment, looks like he was a tad overrated coming in.

Good to see Tyler Buchner getting into the games and not just for garbage time. Looking forward to seeing him grow into the starting QB for next season. He looks to have a ton of potential. Who knows, maybe he’s the starter before too much longer???

For the remainder of the season, would be nice to see the D start to come together and dominate some games. There have been a ton of freshmen getting meaningful PT, which is great to see.
 

 

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I don’t see a single thing to be impressed by. Our best win is against a 3 - 2 Va. Tech team. Not very impressed at all. We lost to a Cincinnati team who is over rated and has less talent top to bottom, at home.  We almost lost to a middling MAC team again at home. We almost lost to a 2-4 FSU team. Even in a rebuilding year this team should never have looked like this. I wish I could be happy with a 5-1 record and if we played a bunch of teams that had relatively the same talent I would 100% be thrilled, but that is not what we have played. If we lost to Alabama the way we lost to Cincinnati I would give these coaches and players all the credit in the world, but we lost to a Cincinnati team that has no business even competing with ND at home. That’s not even mentioning the horrendous decision to put a ND home game on an online pay service and the stadium turning red for the biggest game of the year. I’m done bitching about a game that really has no impact on my life. Time to get back to real life.

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23 minutes ago, ndfanatic78 said:

I don’t see a single thing to be impressed by. Our best win is against a 3 - 2 Va. Tech team. Not very impressed at all. We lost to a Cincinnati team who is over rated and has less talent top to bottom, at home.  We almost lost to a middling MAC team again at home. We almost lost to a 2-4 FSU team. Even in a rebuilding year this team should never have looked like this. I wish I could be happy with a 5-1 record and if we played a bunch of teams that had relatively the same talent I would 100% be thrilled, but that is not what we have played. If we lost to Alabama the way we lost to Cincinnati I would give these coaches and players all the credit in the world, but we lost to a Cincinnati team that has no business even competing with ND at home. That’s not even mentioning the horrendous decision to put a ND home game on an online pay service and the stadium turning red for the biggest game of the year. I’m done bitching about a game that really has no impact on my life. Time to get back to real life.

Agree completely with this.  The schedule this year is pathetic and we were completely out coached against Cincy.  5-1 is great, but I also care about the product I see on the field.  I see an offense that has no identity, can't run the ball, and has just enough playmakers to squeak out points against lesser talent.  I see a defense still finding its way, showing signs of improvement one minute and giving up big plays the next.  Think of it this way, does ND look like a top 10 team, much less a top 15 team in a 'normal' year of college football?  

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2 minutes ago, NDFootballGuy said:

Agree completely with this.  The schedule this year is pathetic and we were completely out coached against Cincy.  5-1 is great, but I also care about the product I see on the field.  I see an offense that has no identity, can't run the ball, and has just enough playmakers to squeak out points against lesser talent.  I see a defense still finding its way, showing signs of improvement one minute and giving up big plays the next.  Think of it this way, does ND look like a top 10 team, much less a top 15 team in a 'normal' year of college football?  

Now I can officially welcome you to DomerDomain. Post often.

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Just based on "how do I feel", I'm certainly much happier with 5-1 than something worse than that.  I can't stand losing to teams that we should beat.  In fact. I'm still smarting from that loss to Tulsa several years ago and that home loss to a bad Northwestern team.  Or that loss at home to a weak USF team.

I don't think much of that much about the close Ball State win, and probably won't think much more about Toledo this year until hearing pundits bring it up.

So knowing we'd have to fill in for a lot of talent that graduated, I'm pretty happy with where we are in general.

If I had to complain, it's because of what some alluded to that given the level of stars we recruit each year, we should not have had many close games and should have beaten that Cincinnati team.

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On 10/12/2021 at 9:04 PM, coltssb said:

I don’t know if it was Prister or who on his show but they nailed exactly how i felt going into the season.  And exactly how I would feel if ND finished 11-1. This would be a Kelly’s best coaching job if they finished twitch that record. 
I actually had them pegged at 10-2 this season. They lost Book and a to. Of talent last year. So, when they lost I didn’t go full melt down blow-up like I usually do. I half expected. 
BUT, when you are 4-0 playing at home and a chance to improve your standing, I felt they needed to win that game. It was another one of those BK moments. 
Either way, what’s done is done and I’d be happy with 11-1 if that happens. 
I’d be a little disappointed with a loss at this point knowing how the second half of the schedule is shaping up. But ND still hasn’t looked great either. So, one more loss would be that upsetting. 
So, greatful at this moment. 

To build on my other response in this thread.

The only reason that an 11-1 record would be considered a huge accomplishment this season is due to Kelly digging himself a deep hole he needed to climb out of (e.g. his previous coaching hires, recruiting/development, etc.) After 12 years, he is supposed to be in a position to reload not rebuild. Whose fault is it that his OL has holes due to two weak classes which came after he hired Quinn as his OL coach? Who decided to not recruit even one LB in the 2020 class and now he has depth issues? Who decided to play only senior WRs so that there is almost no returning experience? Why are a large number of freshmen needed to play? Why did his national search for OC and OL coaches consist of looking down the hallway from his office? Why did he give Jurkovec almost no playing time (Clemson's punter had more passing attempts) so he decided to transfer and Kelly is now playing QB flavor of the week grab-bag?

Is Kelly a very good coach. Yes, I will admit that. Is he a great coach who I think will win a NC? No, not in my opinion. 

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4 minutes ago, jbrown_9999 said:

To build on my other response in this thread.

The only reason that an 11-1 record would be considered a huge accomplishment this season is due to Kelly digging himself a deep hole he needed to climb out of (e.g. his previous coaching hires, recruiting/development, etc.) After 12 years, he is supposed to be in a position to reload not rebuild. Whose fault is it that his OL has holes due to two weak classes which came after he hired Quinn as his OL coach? Who decided to not recruit even one LB in the 2020 class and now he has depth issues? Who decided to play only senior WRs so that there is almost no returning experience? Why are a large number of freshmen needed to play? Why did his national search for OC and OL coaches consist of looking down the hallway from his office? Why did he give Jurkovec almost no playing time (Clemson's punter had more passing attempts) so he decided to transfer and Kelly is now playing QB flavor of the week grab-bag?

Is Kelly a very good coach. Yes, I will admit that. Is he a great coach who I think will win a NC? No, not in my opinion. 

To be fair they had Marist and Moala both get injured in the pre-season. Those were your starters. I thiwho left for Colorado. And they still have  5 somewhat experienced linebackers in Bauer, White, Kiser, Pryor, and Bertrand. So, I don’t see your argument in the linebacking department. Especially, when those guys were recruited to run a different scheme. That’s why they may not be as athletic as we would want right now. 
As for complete rebuild. I see your point and Im normally in the same boat as you in terms of recruiting better and this shouldn’t happen. My only thought is that it does happen occasionally. And it’s this time that it is. Look at Clemson. It just takes one bad recruiting cycle or a few bad injuries to derail an offense with a bad offensive line. It happens. 
I agree that Quinn should go in the off-season. I also think they missed on some guys like you said which hurt. They also had some guys transfer that hurt. Like Dillon Gibbons?  Why?  
Coaches are allowed to get a pass once in awhile at ND. Holtz had a few sub par years while at Nd too. 
However, Kelly better have a much improved team in all aspects next year when they have a ton of talent coming back. 

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Happy with the record considering the circumstances.  Not happy with how we got to this record.  I hope we finish 11-1 and all of these kids get to work out kinks and work their way through adversity.  I hope the committee sees through the record though.  11-1 screams NY6 but the on field results do not so I hope we do not get an NY6 game.  I'd prefer a win in a bowl a tier below the NY6 bowls than another embarrassment in an NY6 bowl. 

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1 hour ago, NYGoldenDomer said:

Happy with the record considering the circumstances.  Not happy with how we got to this record.  I hope we finish 11-1 and all of these kids get to work out kinks and work their way through adversity.  I hope the committee sees through the record though.  11-1 screams NY6 but the on field results do not so I hope we do not get an NY6 game.  I'd prefer a win in a bowl a tier below the NY6 bowls than another embarrassment in an NY6 bowl. 

Agreed. I am good with the record for the next few days. Saturday is a must win for me. I would hate to finish the season 6 and 6 but if by some awful set of circumstances we did, I would want that one more win to be SC. Win next week and this can be a rebuilding year.

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18 hours ago, NYGoldenDomer said:

Happy with the record considering the circumstances.  Not happy with how we got to this record.  I hope we finish 11-1 and all of these kids get to work out kinks and work their way through adversity.  I hope the committee sees through the record though.  11-1 screams NY6 but the on field results do not so I hope we do not get an NY6 game.  I'd prefer a win in a bowl a tier below the NY6 bowls than another embarrassment in an NY6 bowl. 

I disagree in that I want ND to finish as high as possible and get into the best bowl possible. If other coaches can get their team to peak in big games and use the weeks pre-game to out-coach the opposing coach, surely BK can win a NY6 Bowl game once in his life.

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2 hours ago, jbrown_9999 said:

I disagree in that I want ND to finish as high as possible and get into the best bowl possible. If other coaches can get their team to peak in big games and use the weeks pre-game to out-coach the opposing coach, surely BK can win a NY6 Bowl game once in his life.

He might be able to do it once in his life.  I just don't see this team being the one time he does it.

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Lost to a team with far less talent, so I'm not happy they're 5-1.

Should be 6-0.

If the loss was to a blue blood power 5 school, I'd be ok at 5-1 with this team since there are so many new starters, but it's not excusable and should never be excusable for ND to lose to a group of 5 team regardless what ranking is in front of the opponent. 

That loss probably saved them an absolute ass whipping by UGA in the playoffs but I say getting to the playoffs and getting your ass whipped by the best team in college football is a lot better than losing to inferior teams in the regular season. 

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15 hours ago, JTennant said:

Lost to a team with far less talent, so I'm not happy they're 5-1.

Should be 6-0.

If the loss was to a blue blood power 5 school, I'd be ok at 5-1 with this team since there are so many new starters, but it's not excusable and should never be excusable for ND to lose to a group of 5 team regardless what ranking is in front of the opponent. 

That loss probably saved them an absolute ass whipping by UGA in the playoffs but I say getting to the playoffs and getting your ass whipped by the best team in college football is a lot better than losing to inferior teams in the regular season. 

I know what you’re saying. The only thing with Georgia is they run that old school I-formation play action game. It allows for teams that are somewhat decent to stay in the game.  So, I’m not sure ND would get blown out just because of their style of play. 

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On 10/23/2021 at 1:17 PM, coltssb said:

I know what you’re saying. The only thing with Georgia is they run that old school I-formation play action game. It allows for teams that are somewhat decent to stay in the game.  So, I’m not sure ND would get blown out just because of their style of play. 

With a better QB yes, as evidenced by UND's previous games against Georgia.

However I watched UGA absolutely embarrass Arkansas's OL which is much better than ND's OL.

They were able to collapse and push the pocket with 4 and play soft zone with 7 and rally to make the tackle.

This year's UGA defense is the equivalent of '19 LSU offense where there will be non-starters in the NFL next year.

I would bet Vegas would put the Irish -12 on a neutral field against them and I think it would be worse than that. Keep in mind UGA's starting QB has been hurt so they haven't been operating at full clip on offense yet.

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On 10/14/2021 at 12:24 PM, NDFootballGuy said:

Agree completely with this.  The schedule this year is pathetic and we were completely out coached against Cincy.  5-1 is great, but I also care about the product I see on the field.  I see an offense that has no identity, can't run the ball, and has just enough playmakers to squeak out points against lesser talent.  I see a defense still finding its way, showing signs of improvement one minute and giving up big plays the next.  Think of it this way, does ND look like a top 10 team, much less a top 15 team in a 'normal' year of college football?  

Beg to differ, You are not "outcoached" when you QB throws and interception in the end zone on the opening drive or when a kick returner fumbles the ball on  your own 20 or the backup QB throws and interception deep in your own territory and your FG kicker misses a chop shot. Mistakes and turnovers giving Cincy point blank scoring range was the difference.

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