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BK and his Recruiting “Epiphany”


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I saw this tweet from Pete Sampson. To be fair, I didn’t hear the entirety of BK’s interview so I am just going off of the info in this tweet:

 

 

This pretty much sums up my thoughts about BK for the last 10 years. He is a good coach but not a great coach. He has had a complacent attitude toward recruiting and he just admitted it. If he only believed ND could be a 10-15 recruiting class rank then that is what he is going to get. He never believed we could do better until just now?? If he never believed then our asst coaches didn’t either and that is why we could never get over the top. Now all of a sudden he believes we can be top 5 consistently. After 10 years?? This is why I have been saying that we need to get a younger, energetic guy that believes ND can be a top program year in and year out and will instill that belief with the assistants and hold them accountable to go out and recruit. BK has been lazy for the last 10 years on the recruiting trail and has been content being good and not great.

 

I don’t believe that he can all of a sudden flip a switch and now be a top 5 recruiting program. We will see but I’m not holding my breath.

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Agree with a lot of that. I definitely would want a younger, energetic coach to replace him when the time comes.

 

To be fair to Kelly, and this is no excuse, many fans have written off our ability to recruit in the top 5. Reading and hearing about the attitude around the assistants though, there is a renewed belief Notre Dame is actually close to being a top 5 program. While I wish that belief would've been present earlier, I am happy it is here at all now.

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I saw this tweet from Pete Sampson. To be fair, I didn’t hear the entirety of BK’s interview so I am just going off of the info in this tweet:

 

 

This pretty much sums up my thoughts about BK for the last 10 years. He is a good coach but not a great coach. He has had a complacent attitude toward recruiting and he just admitted it. If he only believed ND could be a 10-15 recruiting class rank then that is what he is going to get. He never believed we could do better until just now?? If he never believed then our asst coaches didn’t either and that is why we could never get over the top. Now all of a sudden he believes we can be top 5 consistently. After 10 years?? This is why I have been saying that we need to get a younger, energetic guy that believes ND can be a top program year in and year out and will instill that belief with the assistants and hold them accountable to go out and recruit. BK has been lazy for the last 10 years on the recruiting trail and has been content being good and not great.

 

I don’t believe that he can all of a sudden flip a switch and now be a top 5 recruiting program. We will see but I’m not holding my breath.

 

I have not read or heard the interview myself, but based on what you said above, I think that I interpret it a little differently maybe.

 

Over BK's time at ND (and for the 20 years preceding him), the program has been all over the place. There have been years with horrific defense (BV years), years with horrific offense (ok, so this is basically most years....either 1 thing is working or nothing is working), years with controversy (suspensions, vacating wins) etc.. Until the last few years, there hasn't been a lot to sell recruits (especially the difference makers in the view of the rankings) outside of pointing at the history books and talking about the 40 year decision.

 

Now, ND is in a better situation. BK believes he has ND in a position to be a top 5 program on the field, and can point to the last few years as evidence when talking to recruits. BK believes the on the field success will translate to recruiting success.

 

I know a lot of you think ND's recruiting issues are coach related, but the reality is that ND is just not as attractive to recruits (especially elite recruits) as it used to be. Outside of a handful of coaches (that likely would not consider ND if you gave them a blank checkbook), no coach would have been able to pull in top 5 classes without first showing some recent success and consistency on the field.....and even then, it will be a difficult sell.

 

Note: I am not saying BK and staff are perfect or doing the absolute best job, I am just saying that until now, there really has not been a whole lot to sell elite recruits (outside of stuff they could read in books that are older they they are).

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While I agree that a young, energetic coach will hopefully take over in the next few years, I personally think we need a few more 10+ win seasons under kelly before we hand the keys to someone else. Say we get 3 more seasons of 10+ wins from Kelly, that would be what 6 in a row? Recruiting will be top 12 over that span, and you have momementum as a year in, year out 10+ win program.... thats when you make the gamble on a young, unexperienced coach to take over.

 

While I no doubt have my serious issues with Kelly, ill never forget the 15 years of below-mediocre teams under the previous 3 coaches... kelly inhereted a mess 15 years in the making... let the next coach inherent a year in, year out 10+ win program and hope he's as good a hire as someone like Dabo (who was a WR coach when hired at Clemson).

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Funny thing, I've always thought the CBK regime has done a pretty good job recruiting. They've landed some stud recruits, and they've found some serious diamonds in the rough. My concern has been developing some of the studs. Seems like there has been a lot of misses on the QB front. CBK has had a lot of great recruits on the QB front, but it hasnt really panned out on the field. That's a problem.

 

Also, is it possible there has been some deals made between the administration, academic staff, and coaching staff in regards to borderline recruits? This alone could be what pushes ND recruiting into the top 5. I'm not talking guys who are CLEARLY not ND material.... but maybe a guy who wants to come but might need a little help. I have no idea if this is the case. Just thinking out loud for the most part.

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I have not read or heard the interview myself, but based on what you said above, I think that I interpret it a little differently maybe.

 

Over BK's time at ND (and for the 20 years preceding him), the program has been all over the place. There have been years with horrific defense (BV years), years with horrific offense (ok, so this is basically most years....either 1 thing is working or nothing is working), years with controversy (suspensions, vacating wins) etc.. Until the last few years, there hasn't been a lot to sell recruits (especially the difference makers in the view of the rankings) outside of pointing at the history books and talking about the 40 year decision.

 

Now, ND is in a better situation. BK believes he has ND in a position to be a top 5 program on the field, and can point to the last few years as evidence when talking to recruits. BK believes the on the field success will translate to recruiting success.

 

I know a lot of you think ND's recruiting issues are coach related, but the reality is that ND is just not as attractive to recruits (especially elite recruits) as it used to be. Outside of a handful of coaches (that likely would not consider ND if you gave them a blank checkbook), no coach would have been able to pull in top 5 classes without first showing some recent success and consistency on the field.....and even then, it will be a difficult sell.

 

Note: I am not saying BK and staff are perfect or doing the absolute best job, I am just saying that until now, there really has not been a whole lot to sell elite recruits (outside of stuff they could read in books that are older they they are).

 

Kelly's two best recruiting years were during his first three full recruiting classes. Since then, given the "coldest seat in America", he seemed to shut it down and stop working as hard on recruiting. Perhaps he realized that he could get Top 15 ish classes working half as hard. Who knows?

 

Like the AT&T commercial, Just OK is not good enough...

 

Kelly reaped what he sowed.

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WOW.....2 threads griping about Kelly's low energy recruiting,,,, a kind of end of season negative malaise I guess,

 

Early in the season time and time again many of you were saying " recruiting has been good overall by Kelly" but now after 11 wins youd think we were talking about TY WILLINGHAM.....

 

He doesn't care enough

He gives low effort

He doesn't like recruiting

He doesn't contact recruits ETC ETC

 

I mean sure everyone can always do better but geeez

 

All I know is we have ND players all over the NFL...Guys always LEAVING early for the draft ....and maybe i'm blind but ive seen a whole lot of really good players on the field the last few years....

 

SOMEONE has been recruiting and closing lots of top recruits!! ;)

 

aloha

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WOW.....2 threads griping about Kelly's low energy recruiting,,,, a kind of end of season negative malaise I guess,

 

Early in the season time and time again many of you were saying " recruiting has been good overall by Kelly" but now after 11 wins youd think we were talking about TY WILLINGHAM.....

 

He doesn't care enough

He gives low effort

He doesn't like recruiting

He doesn't contact recruits ETC ETC

 

I mean sure everyone can always do better but geeez

 

All I know is we have ND players all over the NFL...Guys always LEAVING early for the draft ....and maybe i'm blind but ive seen a whole lot of really good players on the field the last few years....

 

SOMEONE has been recruiting and closing lots of top recruits!! ;)

 

aloha

 

agreed. we are definitely trying to explain the 2 losses more than enjoy the 11 wins. I'm going to enjoy 11, its been awhile since we've had 3 seasons this good.

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WOW.....2 threads griping about Kelly's low energy recruiting,,,, a kind of end of season negative malaise I guess,

 

Early in the season time and time again many of you were saying " recruiting has been good overall by Kelly" but now after 11 wins youd think we were talking about TY WILLINGHAM.....

 

He doesn't care enough

He gives low effort

He doesn't like recruiting

He doesn't contact recruits ETC ETC

 

I mean sure everyone can always do better but geeez

 

All I know is we have ND players all over the NFL...Guys always LEAVING early for the draft ....and maybe i'm blind but ive seen a whole lot of really good players on the field the last few years....

 

SOMEONE has been recruiting and closing lots of top recruits!! ;)

 

aloha

 

Unfortunately, ND's "lots" of top recruits were only good enough to be ranked 15th prior to the CFP, leaving ND on the outside looking in since other schools with coaches who work harder at recruiting had lots more top recruits who lost less games and made the CFP.

 

Kelly in his ten years of recruiting only had single digit classes twice. They both happened in his first three full classes before he was told he had the "coldest seat in America".

 

He does not seem to really want to win the NC given that he does not seem to be doing everything he can from a recruiting perspective.

 

(BTW, I have been on Kelly for not recruiting at a high enough level for awhile now)

Edited by jbrown_9999
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What is our best win?

 

Thats the life of new ACC deal as long as we play the coastal. To blame on Kelly is pointless. So just so you have what you want its Navy, Virginia, USC, Virginia Tech etc.. all below standard..

 

I guess its Kelly's problem USC keeps Helton too. The schedule as very little to do with the head coach.

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ND is the seems to be the top recruiting school among the upper echelon academic schools.

 

I think Kelly could do a little more but I don't think his involvement is incredibly concerning. I put more on the positional coaches.

 

Just read somewhere about the impact Kelly had on Rocco Spindler at the USC game. Kelly took time away to have an impromptu meeting with Spindler and apparently it was well received.

 

Kelly should be personally involved with all 5 star recruits and some of the 4 stars. Also, if I'm not mistaken, ND has more time requirements on the head coach than other schools when it comes to alumni functions.

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Thats the life of new ACC deal as long as we play the coastal. To blame on Kelly is pointless. So just so you have what you want its Navy, Virginia, USC, Virginia Tech etc.. all below standard..

 

I guess its Kelly's problem USC keeps Helton too. The schedule as very little to do with the head coach.

You did not answer the question. What was our best win?

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WOW.....2 threads griping about Kelly's low energy recruiting,,,, a kind of end of season negative malaise I guess,

 

Early in the season time and time again many of you were saying " recruiting has been good overall by Kelly" but now after 11 wins youd think we were talking about TY WILLINGHAM.....

 

He doesn't care enough

He gives low effort

He doesn't like recruiting

He doesn't contact recruits ETC ETC

 

I mean sure everyone can always do better but geeez

 

All I know is we have ND players all over the NFL...Guys always LEAVING early for the draft ....and maybe i'm blind but ive seen a whole lot of really good players on the field the last few years....

 

SOMEONE has been recruiting and closing lots of top recruits!! ;)

 

aloha

 

It’s always nice to hear from you Hawaii. I thought I was on that other ND site the one that has the prerequisite that you have to be always negative and complain until I saw your post. Please don’t change.

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He should be involved with each and every kid that wants to play here...

 

I am sure he does to some extent; do you really think a freshmen comes in and Kelly goes, "who are you? What position you play?" I think the issue with high school kids is how much attention is dedicated to them. I am sure Kelly has contact with every recruit, but it is simply not feasible for him to shower each kid with all the attention they think they deserve.

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Thats the life of new ACC deal as long as we play the coastal. To blame on Kelly is pointless. So just so you have what you want its Navy, Virginia, USC, Virginia Tech etc.. all below standard..

 

I guess its Kelly's problem USC keeps Helton too. The schedule as very little to do with the head coach.

 

Oh come on! Don’t act like BK hasn’t had his chances to win big games!

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I am sure he does to some extent; do you really think a freshmen comes in and Kelly goes, "who are you? What position you play?" I think the issue with high school kids is how much attention is dedicated to them. I am sure Kelly has contact with every recruit, but it is simply not feasible for him to shower each kid with all the attention they think they deserve.

 

According to 2 top recruits who recently declined to come to ND, other top coaches are giving the attention needed. One even said Day from OSU texted him on the day they played in the semifinals. It’s part of the job now in CFB. If you don’t like showering HS kids with attention then be prepared to lose out to other programs who will. I don’t necessarily like having to shower some of these kids with attention but it is what it is. BK needs to do what Saban, Dabo, Orgeron, Day, Cristobal, etc are doing or he will be left out.

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According to 2 top recruits who recently declined to come to ND, other top coaches are giving the attention needed. One even said Day from OSU texted him on the day they played in the semifinals. It’s part of the job now in CFB. If you don’t like showering HS kids with attention then be prepared to lose out to other programs who will. I don’t necessarily like having to shower some of these kids with attention but it is what it is. BK needs to do what Saban, Dabo, Orgeron, Day, Cristobal, etc are doing or he will be left out.

 

One of the issues is that Kelly never worked at a major program as anything other than a head coach so he never had a chance to see how top programs recruit. He learned how to recruit at Assumption and Grand Valley State.

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There is a large POOL of 4 and 5 star players that Kelly simply CANNOT RECRUIT.....academically or otherwise UNQUALIFIED to play here or go here....

 

Saban Dabo Orgeron can compete with each other for literally ANY RECRUIT THEY WANT!!!!

 

That is giant handicap for ND when it comes to recruiting top players,,,,we cannot go after everyone...

 

some of you fella's need to be realistic about NDs situation compared to Bama Clemson ETC.....its not just about PHONE CALLS ;)

 

aloha

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There is a large POOL of 4 and 5 star players that Kelly simply CANNOT RECRUIT.....academically or otherwise UNQUALIFIED to play here or go here....

 

Saban Dabo Orgeron can compete with each other for literally ANY RECRUIT THEY WANT!!!!

 

That is giant handicap for ND when it comes to recruiting top players,,,,we cannot go after everyone...

 

some of you fella's need to be realistic about NDs situation compared to Bama Clemson ETC.....its not just about PHONE CALLS ;)

 

aloha

 

But on the flip side, wouldn't that make you work even harder for the ones you can go after?

 

If out of the top 100, ND can only admit 50, they better go balls out after those 50. The rest of the schools have a 100 hundred they have to target, ND only has 50. They should devote even more time to each player by that logic.

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