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Did Kelly kill another QB?


jon33dn
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Next year he will display total regression. Last night was just a better coached and more talented team.

 

Yep. You can't call it regression until you see an inability to make reads against lesser Ds or an inexplicable loss of accuracy.....

 

Anyone would look mortal against Clemson or Bama's defense....

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Yep. You can't call it regression until you see an inability to make reads against lesser Ds or an inexplicable loss of accuracy.....

 

Anyone would look mortal against Clemson or Bama's defense....

 

Yeah we dropped a number of catchable passes as well. So I think regression is much too strong of a claim right now.

 

Now I'll give you regression in the redzone(updated the offensive study thread) but I will also tell you Quenton Nelson was very good in the NFL this year. Bars woulda helped too as well as McGlinchey.

 

 

Running the ball is key in the redzone and we took a hit losing the Eagles Starting running back Josh Adams too.

 

 

Way to soon to go on this narrative in my opinion. Kudos to you for not doing it being 12-1.

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Yeah we dropped a number of catchable passes as well. So I think regression is much too strong of a claim right now.

 

Now I'll give you regression in the redzone(updated the offensive study thread) but I will also tell you Quenton Nelson was very good in the NFL this year. Bars woulda helped too as well as McGlinchey.

 

 

Running the ball is key in the redzone and we took a hit losing the Eagles Starting running back Josh Adams too.

 

 

Way to soon to go on this narrative in my opinion. Kudos to you for not doing it being 12-1.

 

 

As Ive said before, I'm thrilled with this season. Double digit win tallies in back to back seasons is precisely the kind of stability/improvement I've been asking for from day 1. I thought we were due for a regression, but we weren't. Appropriate changes were made across the board and our coaches were able to squeeze all the talent they could from the caliber of players we had in the stables. And, to be honest, there is absolutely no excuse for notching less than 10 wins when we can still somehow attract immense talent despite not being able to reasonably promise a national championship run to recruits.

 

The fans who still truly believe we are capable of winning a title...or even being quasi-competitive in the current landscape of CFB are just falling victim to false hope. Every longtime fan knows that the last time we ran the tables and took home a title, we had several key players on the team who wouldn't qualify at ND today.

 

With our lack of academic exceptions and the inevitable gravitation of NFL hopefuls toward schools that will just let them be athletes before students, what we accomplished this season is going to be the absolute max for several years to come...

 

I accepted that a long time ago....

Edited by echo88
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Subpar arm that is protected by the all the boundary throws they call. Gamer though. Last night he was seeing ghosts and played scared. Too big of a moment for him IMHO

 

Yup. He's decent but looked out of his depth yesterday. Nothing to be ashamed of but he's not a NC QB.

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As Ive said before, I'm thrilled with this season. Double digit win tallies in back to back seasons is precisely the kind of stability/improvement I've been asking for from day 1. I thought we were due for a regression, but we weren't. Appropriate changes were made across the board and our coaches were able to squeeze all the talent they could from the caliber of players we had in the stables. And, to be honest, there is absolutely no excuse for notching less than 10 wins when we can still somehow attract immense talent despite not being able to reasonably promise a national championship run to recruits.

 

The fans who still truly believe we are capable of winning a title...or even being quasi-competitive in the current landscape of CFB are just falling victim to false hope. Every longtime fan knows that the last time we ran the tables and took home a title, we had several key players on the team who wouldn't qualify at ND today.

 

With our lack of academic exceptions and the inevitable gravitation of NFL hopefuls toward schools that will just let them be athletes before students, what we accomplished this season is going to be the absolute max for several years to come...

 

I accepted that a long time ago....

 

 

There certainly has to be some sort of middle ground between athletic focused college degrees and football players expected to be pro's on the field and in the classroom. I'm wondering if the Next AD will be a former player? I think that would help.

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The fans who still truly believe we are capable of winning a title...or even being quasi-competitive in the current landscape of CFB are just falling victim to false hope. Every longtime fan knows that the last time we ran the tables and took home a title, we had several key players on the team who wouldn't qualify at ND today.

 

When did ND change the qualifying standards and what was the reason to all of the sudden just do it?

 

If they really care about money they should be going back to how they used to do it. The players still must maintain a certain gpa right? It’s not like kids can’t improve their grades from high school to college, allow these kids to attend but make sure the stipulation is them improving in the classroom or they’re ineligible.

 

I had poor grades in high school and terrible grades my first year of university but graduated with a 4.0 gpa from study habits I had developed.

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When did ND change the qualifying standards and what was the reason to all of the sudden just do it?

 

If they really care about money they should be going back to how they used to do it. The players still must maintain a certain gpa right? It’s not like kids can’t improve their grades from high school to college, allow these kids to attend but make sure the stipulation is them improving in the classroom or they’re ineligible.

 

I had poor grades in high school and terrible grades my first year of university but graduated with a 4.0 gpa from study habits I had developed.

 

I think the Christian thing to do is give borderline students a chance, if they’re willing to put in the work. Thing is it’s not enough to just qualify, you’ve got to stay eligible. That means going to class and doing the work.

 

 

I want to know how a prestigious Academic school like Michigan handles athletes.

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As Ive said before, I'm thrilled with this season. Double digit win tallies in back to back seasons is precisely the kind of stability/improvement I've been asking for from day 1. I thought we were due for a regression, but we weren't. Appropriate changes were made across the board and our coaches were able to squeeze all the talent they could from the caliber of players we had in the stables. And, to be honest, there is absolutely no excuse for notching less than 10 wins when we can still somehow attract immense talent despite not being able to reasonably promise a national championship run to recruits.

 

The fans who still truly believe we are capable of winning a title...or even being quasi-competitive in the current landscape of CFB are just falling victim to false hope. Every longtime fan knows that the last time we ran the tables and took home a title, we had several key players on the team who wouldn't qualify at ND today.

 

With our lack of academic exceptions and the inevitable gravitation of NFL hopefuls toward schools that will just let them be athletes before students, what we accomplished this season is going to be the absolute max for several years to come...

 

I accepted that a long time ago....

 

You say you accepted that, but you love to b1tch. The requirements aren’t that high for someone with a functional brain and decent work ethic. Kids are just lazier and don’t want the pain in the azz. Calculus isn’t helping get them to the NFL.

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I don’t like the extremes. Earlier in the season some had him on par with Montana and Quinn. After a poor performance against one of the best teams on the country and THE best line, he is now Dayne Christ? He is in the middle. Book is a good college quarterback that needs good players around him. He is not a “one man gang” that’s going to will us to a championship on his back.

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I think the Christian thing to do is give borderline students a chance, if they’re willing to put in the work. Thing is it’s not enough to just qualify, you’ve got to stay eligible. That means going to class and doing the work.

 

 

I want to know how a prestigious Academic school like Michigan handles athletes.

 

Couple things. I don't know that the Christian thing works anymore, weird to say about a Catholic school, you don't see being a good Christian as a basis of getting into ND not that I know it ever was. But I have questioned why ND has to be so strict and rigorous academically for all students when it didn't seem to be that way once upon a time when average to good students stood a chance of being accepted.

 

As to Michigan, I believe Harbaugh addressed this a few years back when he spoke a bit controversially how UM hid their players in general studies never requiring them to seek an actual degree like Stanford. I have know idea if that's changed since he's now the *ahem* HC coach there.

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You say you accepted that, but you love to b1tch. The requirements aren’t that high for someone with a functional brain and decent work ethic. Kids are just lazier and don’t want the pain in the azz. Calculus isn’t helping get them to the NFL.

 

Incorrect. I have a problem when the players we have are made to look like 2-3* recruits while playing a team with a quarter of our talent. Under BK, it happens a handful of times per year. Usually it results in an unfathomable loss, but this year, as with 2012, the bounces went our way and we ended up undefeated.

 

There is an obvious point of contention surrounding last night's game where some of us think we just played a team with eons more talent and the score reflects that. The other side (including myself) believes that we simply shat the bed and that Clemson has a HC who know how to prepare a team for the playoffs.

 

The score last night should've been more like 30-21 at worst. The only reason I'm disappointed is that it was so lob-sided when we had chance after chance to hang with them. Stupid mistakes, unprepared backups, etc....it's what separates legit title contenders from our team.

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Incorrect. I have a problem when the players we have are made to look like 2-3* recruits while playing a team with a quarter of our talent. Under BK, it happens a handful of times per year. Usually it results in an unfathomable loss, but this year, as with 2012, the bounces went our way and we ended up undefeated.

 

There is an obvious point of contention surrounding last night's game where some of us think we just played a team with eons more talent and the score reflects that. The other side (including myself) believes that we simply shat the bed and that Clemson has a HC who know how to prepare a team for the playoffs.

 

The score last night should've been more like 30-21 at worst. The only reason I'm disappointed is that it was so lob-sided when we had chance after chance to hang with them. Stupid mistakes, unprepared backups, etc....it's what separates legit title contenders from our team.

 

This is your best post ever...cheers...I think it is mostly in mentality

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Incorrect. I have a problem when the players we have are made to look like 2-3* recruits while playing a team with a quarter of our talent. Under BK, it happens a handful of times per year. Usually it results in an unfathomable loss, but this year, as with 2012, the bounces went our way and we ended up undefeated.

 

There is an obvious point of contention surrounding last night's game where some of us think we just played a team with eons more talent and the score reflects that. The other side (including myself) believes that we simply shat the bed and that Clemson has a HC who know how to prepare a team for the playoffs.

 

The score last night should've been more like 30-21 at worst. The only reason I'm disappointed is that it was so lob-sided when we had chance after chance to hang with them. Stupid mistakes, unprepared backups, etc....it's what separates legit title contenders from our team.

 

Agreed. I'm always wanting more talent and the highest rated players out there, greedy like that since the days of Holtz. Frankly having both almost ensures success, good/great coach and players. We should push to keep getting and maintaining both consistently.

 

Consistency has been our biggest problem since Holtz. We have not been able to keep momentum in the program, a really good year or two is followed by mediocre or bad ones. Great coaches will consistently win and be prepared, figuring out what it takes to maintain that high level for sustained periods where 10-2 is the floor for a season. By virtue winning brings in the talent and doing it consistently keeps the recruiting classes higher ranked.

 

Now here we are with back to back 10+ win seasons, which like you I'm happy for, but we have to keep that train going. This is how Dabo finally got over the hump, consistency and learning through experience how to prepare, recruit, and adjust to be the best.

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Agreed. I'm always wanting more talent and the highest rated players out there, greedy like that since the days of Holtz. Frankly having both almost ensures success, good/great coach and players. We should push to keep getting and maintaining both consistently.

 

Consistency has been our biggest problem since Holtz. We have not been able to keep momentum in the program, a really good year or two is followed by mediocre or bad ones. Great coaches will consistently win and be prepared, figuring out what it takes to maintain that high level for sustained periods where 10-2 is the floor for a season. By virtue winning brings in the talent and doing it consistently keeps the recruiting classes higher ranked.

 

Now here we are with back to back 10+ win seasons, which like you I'm happy for, but we have to keep that train going. This is how Dabo finally got over the hump, consistency and learning through experience how to prepare, recruit, and adjust to be the best.

 

Mostly agree with everything you have said Jesse. I do think that winning will give you an opportunity to recruit better players. But getting blown out last night and losing every New Years 6/BCS Bowl game by an average of 24 pts, makes us look like pretenders. We lose whatever chance we could have at 5 stars because we look stupid, outcoached and under prepared for these big games. We have a better record than Washington but they their fans think it's a win for them if they take home the Big Daddy of them all trophy. We end up with a better record and greater embarrassment than them regardless of the outcome of that game. We can't compete on the recruiting trail for what truly wins Championships. We all know what wins Championships. We don't get those guys and will not anymore under the current system and our current administrative perspective about player athletes and standards. This is also why our Basketball team will never win the big one either.

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Mostly agree with everything you have said Jesse. I do think that winning will give you an opportunity to recruit better players. But getting blown out last night and losing every New Years 6/BCS Bowl game by an average of 24 pts, makes us look like pretenders. We lose whatever chance we could have at 5 stars because we look stupid, outcoached and under prepared for these big games. We have a better record than Washington but they their fans think it's a win for them if they take home the Big Daddy of them all trophy. We end up with a better record and greater embarrassment than them regardless of the outcome of that game. We can't compete on the recruiting trail for what truly wins Championships. We all know what wins Championships. We don't get those guys and will not anymore under the current system and our current administrative perspective about player athletes and standards. This is also why our Basketball team will never win the big one either.

 

There have been blowouts by other schools/coaches too. Because we are ND the spotlight is definitely brighter and harsher for us than most other programs. Yes we have built in limitations with recruiting, but we also haven't kept ourselves at the forefront in recruits minds by consistently staying in the conversation.

 

OU despite having some big time losses in major bowls and NC games, consistently stayed in the conversation year after year. That's just one example, and yes I realize they don't operate with the same restrictions we do in recruiting. But consistency year in and year out means something, and we haven't been able to build that for a long time even under BK entering year ten.

 

Just because a recruit is elite doesn't mean they are terrible in the classroom. We've fought for elite recruits with the likes of Stanford and UVA over the past decade, very good schools to be sure. We've also gone against the jock schools for good student/elite athletes who qualified here and failed to land them. ND isn't what everyone is looking for in a school which is hard to overcome. We have to give them reasons to come here, being in the conversation and winning a ton yearly certainly can help.

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Even if we had many 5 star players, I still don't see Kelly leading us to victory. I'm thankful he's made a lot of positive changes to this program. I'd like to see a revision on Jucos. We're a Christian college; we shouldn't exclude people.

 

Book will make a slight improvement next year but he'll gain predominantly from a more senior offensive line. It'll help too that Philco will push Book now that there's not Wimbush to muddy the competition.

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